296: Jan-Benedict Steenkamp – Leadership Lessons from History

296: Jan-Benedict Steenkamp – Leadership Lessons from History

Jan-Benedict Steenkamp was doing very well in the academe when he hit a hump in his life. He was regularly writing many academic publications but became dispirited and demotivated when he was not able to see how his publications could move the needle in someone else’s life. Through reinventing himself, JB started writing business books where leaders and managers could read what he wrote and make a positive impact in their lives. Despite facing opposition from others around him, JB continues to do what he loves and make a positive impact to those around him.

295: Nate Regier – Unleashing the Potential in Each Person

295: Nate Regier – Unleashing the Potential in Each Person

Nate Regier was trying to sell to a particular CEO who kept poking holes in everything he was saying. Nate was trying to backpedal and explain but things just kept getting worse and worse. Finally, the CEO pushes Nate to the point where Nate decides not to compromise any further because it would no longer make him feel any integrity in the work that he provides. After seemingly being kicked out from the office, Nate was surprised when the CEO called him and says he’s hired. The CEO appreciated his conviction to stand up for what he truly believed in. From that experience, Nate learned that if he wants to be a top leader, he needs to be able to go toe to toe with the worst and to have the backbone to never compromise with his beliefs.

294: Neil Sahota – Artificial Intelligence for Good

294: Neil Sahota – Artificial Intelligence for Good

After the IBM Watson team won the Jeopardy challenge, Neil Sahota was fighting for the ecosystem model to try to open up the platform. A lot of the people was trying to engage the tech people, but Neil was trying to target the businesspeople. According to Neil, the businesspeople understood the problems more, they were on the ground, and if they were trying to build solutions, they were the people that need to be at the table with the technologists. Neil initially lost that fight, but he never gave up.

Neil convinced them that if they had five of the best technologists in the world then they would be thinking about self-driving cars and missions to Mars, but if they had five of the best doctors in the world then they would be thinking about curing cancer. What if they were to put them together?

During that epiphany moment, people realized the amazing impact that technology can bring across every sector if they were to join together business and technology. This amalgam between business and technology became one of Neil’s biggest humps that he was able to overcome.

293: Julie Winkle Giulioni – Helping Leaders and Employees Grow in their Careers

293: Julie Winkle Giulioni – Helping Leaders and Employees Grow in their Careers

Julie Winkle Giulioni took a role that looked so prestigious. By the end of the first week, she knew she made a dreadful mistake. All of her instincts told her to run for the door, but she didn’t. At that time, she decided that she needed to make a one-year commitment and was going to make the best of that situation. While it didn’t turn out the way that she expected and it didn’t send her down the career trajectory that she dreamt of, what she did do was mind that experience.

It was a rough environment, but she decided each day to look for where the learning was, where could she try one new thing, where she could exercise one new skill, or just get a little bit better at anything. It got her through the year, and it was probably the richest growth experience that she’d had in terms of know the grit that she had and her ability to get through and make the best of it.

292: Jeff DeGraff – Becoming More Creative in Your Ability to Innovate

292: Jeff DeGraff – Becoming More Creative in Your Ability to Innovate

While he was in college, Jeff DeGraff had a whole series of events that would change his life forever. Every time his life blew up (whether it was having no place to live or not having any money) Jeff would start looking around to what was available to him and to do everything he can with what he had. He realized that he didn’t think or act like other people did and had to do things a bit differently and creatively. It was from his mistakes that he learned to accept the various things he was naturally good at and to consider them as gifts and to stop trying to become somebody he was not.

291: Aaron McHugh – Transforming Disengaged Leaders into Hopeful Leaders

291: Aaron McHugh – Transforming Disengaged Leaders into Hopeful Leaders

Aaron McHugh Show Notes Page

Aaron McHugh was experiencing a lot of difficulties in his life, particularly with his career, his kids, and his daughter’s health. During that time, one of his buddies came and said to him, “You might not be able to change your circumstance but you can own your atmosphere.” It completely changed him and made him take this idea of taking ownership of the atmosphere of his life. Aaron learned that it’s about starting small and taking 2° changes that will eventually build up and lead to somewhere else.

Aaron grew up in Southern California, and in the mountains of the Sierra Nevada. His dad was a pastor in a small church, and his grandfather worked at Disneyland.

Aaron’s the oldest of three, and early in his childhood, you could find him playing in the creek or chasing lightning bugs in the woods.

Early in his career, he was selling 60-second radio commercials to liquor stores and bars but was becoming elated with how ideas can change the world.

Later in his career in software and technology traveling the globe, he found himself in board rooms with executives not living his fullest and best life. After personal burnout in 2015, you found himself on the sidelines of life personally and professionally.

With one child in a drug recovery program and another who passed away, he and his wife and youngest daughter retreated to the mountains to volunteer at a young life camp for high school kids.

During that time of pause and reflection, they began to imagine what a life would look like it would get them out of bed every day.

Today after their big reboot of selling everything they owned and starting over now, Aaron is doing work he loves working with executives leading transformational reboots in the workplace.

Aaron is a writer, podcaster, adventurer, and author of the best-selling book, Fire Your Boss: Discover Work you Love Without Quitting Your Job. He is mastering the art of living a sustainable work-life balance that constantly interweaves rhythms of play and adventure.

That includes road trips in their 1974 VW Bus, aka The Joy Bus, catapulting them into many father-daughter adventures together.

Aaron works as an Affiliate Advisor to Aberkyn, a division of McKinsey & Co as a facilitator of transformation and executive coach.

He and his wife Leith live in Colorado Springs, CO. They are celebrating twenty-five years of marriage in December. Their marriage survived the death of their twelve-year-old daughter Hadley in 2011. And their twenty-two-year-old son Holden lives in Costa Mesa and is thriving in recovery three years clean and sober. Their youngest daughter lives at home still.

Tweetable Quotes and Mentions

Listen to @aarondmchugh get over the hump on the @FastLeaderShowClick to Tweet

“Heretics create a reality in a world they want to live in to. They move beyond conventional wisdom to architect a future and a place they want to go.” – Click to Tweet

“The base premise is how do we delight our customers? What does it look like for us to create and innovate with them in mind?” – Click to Tweet

“Oftentimes hardship is the assignment.” – Click to Tweet

“Every boss I’ve ever had has a lesson to teach me – the good ones, but especially the bad ones.” – Click to Tweet

“The problem with blamers is that they rarely take accountability and responsibility for their own actions. That blame is the projection and assignment of pain on someone else.” – Click to Tweet

“In the wilderness, if you adjust 2° and walk half a mile, it’s not a big deal, but if you walk 50 miles, 2° is a big deal.” – Click to Tweet

“Start with the life you have today. Don’t quit your job. Stay where you are and start the revolution with small increments of try and experimentation and 2 little degree adjustments.” – Click to Tweet

“Just try one thing this week that’s different and over time it will build up.” – Click to Tweet

“Almost everything will work again if you unplug it for a few minutes, including you.” – Click to Tweet

“If you can win the morning, you can win the day.” – Click to Tweet

“Once you take agency or ownership over what’s in front of you right now, then everything from there becomes much easier.” – Click to Tweet

Hump to Get Over

Aaron McHugh was experiencing a lot of difficulties in his life, particularly with his career, his kids, and his daughter’s health. During that time, one of his buddies came and said to him, “You might not be able to change your circumstance but you can own your atmosphere.” It completely changed him and made him take this idea of taking ownership of the atmosphere of his life. Aaron learned that it’s about starting small and taking 2° changes that will eventually build up and lead to somewhere else.

Advice for others

Your wife is right more than she’s wrong.

Holding him back from being an even better leader

I care too much about what other people think.

Best Leadership Advice

Say, “I’m sorry.”

Secret to Success

I believe in God.

Best tools in business or life

I’m eternally optimistic.

Recommended Reading

Fire Your Boss: Discover Work You Love Without Quitting Your Job

Essentialism: The Disciplined Pursuit of Less

Contacting Aaron McHugh

Aaron’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/aarondmchugh

Aaron’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aaronmchugh/

Aaron’s website: https://www.aaronmchugh.com/

Resources

 

Show Transcript

Click to access unedited transcript

Unedited Transcript

Jim Rembach (00:00):

Okay, fast leader Legion today. I’m excited because we have somebody on the show

Speaker 2 (00:03):

Day who will give you a little bit of a

Jim Rembach (00:05):

Different perspective on finding engagement and happiness at work. Aaron McHugh grew up in Southern California in the mountains of this year in Nevada. His dad was a pastor in a small church and his grandfather worked at Disneyland. Aaron’s the oldest of three and early in his childhood. He could be found playing in a Creek or chasing lightning bugs in the woods early in his career. He was selling 62nd radio commercials to liquor stores and bars, but became elated with how ideas can change the world. Later in his career in software and technology, traveling the globe, he found himself in board rooms with executives, not living their fullest and their best life. After personal burnout. In 2015, he found himself on the sidelines of life personally and professionally with one child in drug recovery program. And another hood passed away. He and his wife and youngest daughter retreated to the mountains to volunteer at a young life camp for high school kids.

Jim Rembach (01:08):

During that time of pause and reflection, they began to imagine what a life would look like if they had the opportunity to get out of bed with passion and fulfillment every single day today, after being after their big reboot of selling everything they owned and starting over now, Aaron’s doing work. He loves working with executives, leading transformational reboots in the workplace. Aaron McHugh is a writer, podcaster, adventurer, and author of the bestselling book. Fire your boss discover work. You love without quitting your job. He’s mastering an art of living a sustainable work life balance that constantly interweaves rhythms of play and adventure. That includes road trips in there. 74 VW bus, AKA the joy bus catapulting them into many father daughter adventures together. Aaron works as an affiliate advisor to African, a division of Mackenzie and company and facilitator of transformation and executive for executive coaching.

Jim Rembach (02:09):

He and his wife, Lief live in Colorado Springs, Colorado. They are celebrating 25 years of marriage in December. Their marriage has survived the death of their 12 year old daughter Hadley in 2011, their 21 year old son Holden lives in Costa Mesa and is thriving and recovering three years clean and sober. Their youngest daughter lives at home Aaron McHugh. Are you ready to help us get over the hump? Yeah, man, that was quite quite the intro. I hope I can live up to it. Well, I know you will. Uh, and I’ve really enjoyed the book and I’m looking forward to our conversation because it is a little bit of a twist in thinking and mindset. Uh, but before we get into that, I’ve given my Legion a little bit about you, but can you share what your current passion is so that we can get to know you even better? I’m working on a life project climbing. I live

Aaron McHugh (03:00):

In Colorado, we have 58, 14,000 foot peaks and I’m down to 17 left. So I started in my twenties. Um, I’m knocking on the door of 50 and I’ve got a project to knock out a good handful of them this summer. So that’s been really fun, like just a, kind of a figurative like conquests of climbing mountains and literal as well

Jim Rembach (03:22):

As you’re saying that I have to think, is that you alone or is it you and others? Is it you and your daughter? Is it you and your wife is a family.

Aaron McHugh (03:28):

Great question. A lot of buddies, um, my family direct family. They don’t love climbing mountains. They think it’s just too hard. They to look at them. So I have some buddies that I do it with and a number of them. It’s kind of like a trophy, I guess, uh, of a conquest to they’re called the fourteeners and there’s the 58. So I have a couple of buddies who have completed them. So I’m on my last, you know, punch list of being able to knock all these out.

Jim Rembach (03:52):

Interesting. You say that and I can definitely see some parallels drawn with the stories that you share and the pathway and the journey that you have in the book, you know, it’s, you know, it’s, it’s a conquest, you know? Uh, and so when I started looking at the book, you know, in the beginning you talk about meaning a conquest that you’ve written this book three times,

Aaron McHugh (04:11):

What do you mean? Yeah, I intentionally, I was talking to my editor and I was trying to write the intro to the book. It was, the book had been written, but now we went to the very beginning to say, okay, now it’s time to write the introduction. And I told them on the phone. I said, you know, actually what I really want to say is, and I just rattled it off. I’m like, I’ve written this book three times. I’ve almost quit. I’m tired of it. So where that came from was about, I don’t even know, 15 years ago, roughly 12 years ago, I sat on my back patio and I started writing what I knew to be longer than a blog post, but shorter than a book at the time. And I basically wrote this kind of like manifesto this fire, your boss core idea.

Aaron McHugh (04:51):

And so I sat down and penned it. Well then a number of years later, I just turned that into like a little ebook number years later. I’m like, you know, I should really put that like in a, in a published self published version in a, uh, what would you call it? Leaflet like size. So I self published it second time I’d written it. And then what had happened is once I actually signed a contract with a publisher, then I’m embarking on the third time to write it. And actually it was really overwhelming when I sat down to write it. It was like, Oh my gosh, how many times am I going to tread over this same story? Which resulted in me writing a brand new book that I hadn’t written before?

Jim Rembach (05:28):

Well, and then I, you know, talking about that journey in that pathway, you know, lends me to believe, you know, and when I, when I, of course, without getting into the book, you look at the cover and the crack, the binding open, um, you start asking yourself the question. I mean, can I really, you know, fire my boss without quitting my job? I mean,

Aaron McHugh (05:48):

How can you do that? Yeah, yeah. In the beginning, what happened, Jim was actually was on a bike ride with a friend. Um, I was much and less wise and I really thought that the way forward was to arrange the circumstances of my life. And so in particular, I had this one boss that I found really challenging to work with, but I needed to keep the job. My family was in full tilt. Our suburban life costs a lot of money. And we had, you know, as you mentioned in the intro, I had a kid that had passed away and one in drug rehab. And so what we looked at was, man, I don’t see any other way around this. Other than I’m going to fire my boss. I just blurted it out on the bike ride to my buddy. And he giggled. And I was like, no, I’m serious. I don’t know how to, but I’m going to find a way to reduce the impact this person is having on me. And so it really began forcing me to then ask some inward questions versus circumstantial questions about the environment or that person’s decisions, whatever it may be.

Jim Rembach (06:53):

Well, I’m part of that leads into something. I think, um, I think all of us might even suffer from a, you talk about it in the book is that we can’t, or we have a very difficult time of articulating what’s inside. Can you provide some insight into that? Yeah.

Aaron McHugh (07:08):

What I find is that for, so, so many of us in life in work, we’re just, I won’t call it autopilot, but we’re just doing life. You know, you wake up, you do a Monday, you wake up and you do a Friday, you wake up, you do a Saturday and then we just rinse and repeat and very infrequently. Do we have the opportunity to, we use a phrase in the consulting work I do about taking a balcony perspective, like getting up on the balcony, looking down and actually, you know, getting an aerial view of what’s happening, what’s going on there. And so what we’ve found is that I realized like part of what my super power is, it’s being able to narrate a story like as a narrator, opens a film and says, here’s what’s happening. Um, I’m not a great character writer. I can’t do any of that, but I do a really good job of like narrating what’s happening in a scene or in a picture or in an environment.

Aaron McHugh (08:02):

And so I found myself like, Oh, okay, I’m going to try and narrate my own experience. And maybe this will help other people. And what I found is that so often it, you have all this churn, um, or mystery, but it’s really hard to get to the bottom of name. And I think there’s two things that compound, that one is very little margin in our life. We’re just always in a go mode. And then secondly is I think leading with questions versus demanding answers. And when we lead with questions with curiosity, then it opens up the possibility of, well, maybe, I don’t know, or maybe this isn’t just a linear equation to be solved. Maybe this is a bigger question to live into.

Jim Rembach (08:47):

Well, as you say that, I start thinking about somebody who talked about some of that issue of being able to articulate it is that oftentimes we’re asking the wrong question. And one of the things that he points out is that we should not be asking why, uh, instead we should be asking what, you know, what do I need to do versus why have I done this? And you know, that those kinds of things are, do you find that similar type of structure that seems to work?

Aaron McHugh (09:13):

Yeah, that’s a great frame. One of the frames that I use a lot is I find, oftentimes we ask destination-based questions, meaning like, um, here I am point X on the map right now where I stand today, but why is where I want to go this other place? And it’s very much, that’s finances, that’s health, that’s marriage, that’s relationships, that’s career. And I think instead that’s super unhelpful very often because the gap between where I am today and where I want to be a better question would be, what would it look like for me to become the kind of person who could thrive at that Y position on the map? And oftentimes I find like that five year plan question, where are you going to be five years from now? What are you going to do? I’ve always been horrible at that question because I’ve always like found by the time five years later, my life has changed. So massively my I’m different, my circumstances are different. The world’s different. So instead of what I’ve learned is like, how can I become an adaptive person where I can thrive in any and all situations. And that to me is a fundamentally different question, which is that kind of reframing is, um, you know, what can I do differently today?

Jim Rembach (10:26):

Well, and for me, what I jokingly say, when somebody says, how you doing or what you’re working on, I’m setting, I’m learning how to master becoming a pivot artist. Nice. I like that.

Aaron McHugh (10:37):

That’s great. Yeah. I often will you say I’m learning to master the art of living, which is an art it’s not a science

Jim Rembach (10:46):

Most definitely. Okay. So when, and I think this is kind of where you get into in the book where you start talking about the, the difference between conventional wisdom and, uh, revolutionary heritable, uh, wisdom. Tell us a little bit about that.

Aaron McHugh (11:04):

Well, it makes me smile, even just the word heretical. What I learned is early on in my life, I was always the person, the kid who asks, um, why do we do it that way? Or how can we, how come it’s this way or, well, who says I was always a challenger in that way and definitely with, uh, not a lot of maturity early on and how I asked those questions. But what I realized is that I was onto something, is that in conventional wisdom, conventional wisdom of our culture today, advertises as it relates to our career, get a good job, make as much money as you can, um, hold onto it for dear life, take two weeks vacations. And that should be enough. It doesn’t matter if you love what you do, you have responsibilities like on and on. So let’s just this. Now we may not be able to actually see them anywhere like a plaque in the office space, but they’re just these, um, conventional wisdom things in the, in the environment.

Aaron McHugh (12:00):

And when I found was that when you research heretics and heretics are revolutionaries, people who caused revolutions, why she just started like making a table of them. And I’m like, you know what? Joan of arc, I remember. Yeah, right. What did she do? Oh, well she’s like 16 years old. And women stay at home and make babies and nurse kids. And she goes to war. I’m like, Oh, look, we’ll Oprah. Like I watched this documentary on Oprah. Well, everyone told Oprah to change her name. And that talk shows are ruled by men back in the day of Phil Donahues. And so I’m like, Oh, heretics create a reality in a world. They want to live into, they, they move beyond conventional wisdom to architect a future and are in a place they want to go. And so I realized like, Oh, well, if you look at statistically right now in our workplace, two thirds of the American workforce, and it’s even worse, globally are disengaged.

Aaron McHugh (13:01):

That’s horrible. One third of the people listening to this actually enjoy what they do every day. So I looked at that and say, hold on, conventional wisdom says, hang tight. Gallup poll says, we’re working on it. We’ll get back to you. When we find a better solution in the meantime, two thirds of people. And we actually have stats that now say how it affects us physiologically our health. Also not only our emotional mental wellbeing, but physical wellbeing, our relationships, our communities we belong to. And so I’m like BS, I’m not, I can’t stand for this. We got to find a way to architect a future that we want to be part of.

Jim Rembach (13:37):

Well, and for me, you know, I come from the customer service and customer experience and contact center world. And, and one of the things that’s so important that talking about studies and the empirical evidence continues to prove out, but yet we still keep fighting it for some darn reason. Is that all of these issues internally affect the customer? Yes, yes, absolutely. It is a Tran it’s a transformative type of, um, and very relational and that if I’m having these issues internally, that they’re going to seep outside. So when you start talking about the work that you’re doing with a lot of these organizations and going through this transformation, how much is the customer in their mind?

Aaron McHugh (14:17):

Oh, I love that question. The work I do is in the context of what they call agile transformations and agile, this methodology rooted back in software. And what’s really cool is it’s super customer centric. It’s the base premise is how do we delight our clients, our customer? What does it look like for us to create and innovate with them in mind and great companies that come to mind like Spotify is one that was early on, real famous for that, um, in how they created their music software. And so there’s lots of that are using agile ideas. So customer is always at the core. And the other thing I think is really important is that the work that I get a chance to do every day is it’s this combination of doing and being. And so often in work, we’re so focused on doing accomplishing back to our conquests word we used earlier and what’s what’s missed.

Aaron McHugh (15:14):

And what I loved about the intro that you worked on together this morning was it’s about being also who am I at an identity level at a human level. And I remember my grandfather, he worked at Disneyland as a kid growing up and he used to say like that people would like leave their brains in their trunks when they would come into Disneyland, the park. And I used to think that was really funny. And so I think I, I just grew up with like a framing of like, you can actually leave parts of you at home. Like you could leave your heart at home. You bring your brain to work, believe your heart at home, leave your mess at home, like lock it up, but make sure when you come to work, you know, bring your brain, get some stuff done and compartmentalize. And when we’ve learned now is that widely that both the human is the human wherever we are. And so it’s learning to bring your whole self to work and which is cool because it unlocks more and unleashes more potential that we can bring with creativity to the solutions that we’re we’re solving for at work.

Jim Rembach (16:20):

Well, and even, um, I don’t know if you’ve followed the work of Susan Fowler, she’s been on the fast leader show a couple of times, and she has really closely followed him, become a domain expert in the science of motivation. And so some of the things that you’re talking about there that’s that that is absolutely true from a scientific perspective and what engages us. So now in the book though, we, when you start talking about this whole boss thing, um, is that worse than you say we’re stuck in a binary way of thinking, what does that mean? Yeah, there’s this great

Aaron McHugh (16:52):

Author that I love, um, Richard Rohr. And he talked about how binary thinking is, um, if then thinking, um, it’s very like, uh, so for instance, for me, when I was looking at some big career changes, when my wife and I, we moved to the mountains and kind of rebooted our life, it was like, well, if I quit my job, I’ll probably be unemployable forever. You know, like, uh, uh, if I, um, let’s see, I don’t think this way anymore. So it’s harder for me to find good examples. There’s some great ones in the book.

Jim Rembach (17:26):

Look you talk specifically about and what I’m referring to, as you say, you know, good boss versus lousy boss, and you’re saying the binary thinking in that is damaged.

Aaron McHugh (17:35):

Yes, that’s great. Um, yeah, in that chapter, thanks Jim, for that, that prompt, um, in that chapter, what I was talking about and it’s called the lessons from the layer, um, and this idea of the hero’s journey of actually going down into where the dragons live so often, um, as it relates to bosses, people put bosses in the category of good and bad. And I did forever until I went to go visit a mentor of mine. And I called him up and said, Hey, can I fly down? It was a business mentor. He was just older, but I asked him, would you be willing to give me some advice? And he was probably 25 years ahead of me on the, uh, you know, on the journey. So I flew down to see him and he was telling me the story about earlier in his career, he had this bad boss. And he told me what he learned was that oftentimes hardship is the assignment. I was like, what, what are you talking about? He’s like, I learned so much from working for this lousy person that now as a CEO in his story, then he’s like, now I lead so differently. And so it really helped me reframe like, Oh, you mean everybody

Jim Rembach (18:47):

I’ve ever had to have

Aaron McHugh (18:49):

To teach me. And he goes, aha. The good ones, but especially the bad ones. So it really helped me say, Oh, so even in my current life today, I work with lots of humans, uh, ones that are, you know, in, uh, side-by-side as colleagues, uh, some that are up, you know, you know, vertically in terms of, uh, where they are in their seniority. And then others are, you know, across the landscaping clients. And I’ve just learned, uh, okay. Everyone has an important lesson to teach me here. Now with that comes my choice. And that was a big piece too, is to learn that I, um, my response and that it’s not, they, if you ever hear the phrase, Oh, they made me feel, or they made me like, Oh, that’s a, that’s a bell ringer, you know, like, Oh yeah, red, red alert. That’s not, Oh, they made me. Oh, interesting. Okay. I used to think that way to you. So learning to become what I talk about learning to lead ourselves. So it’s really taking back the agency and ownership and especially of reframing those stories as it relates to

Jim Rembach (19:53):

Well, and talking about that self component, you talk about your four by five self. What is your four by five? So, yeah, actually I have him

Aaron McHugh (20:01):

Sitting here right next to me. Um, so when I,

Jim Rembach (20:04):

Right, I got out of college, I had this

Aaron McHugh (20:07):

Big dream, like wide-eyed, you know, the world’s my oyster. And we moved to Colorado and I worked for a camp. My wife and I are newly married. We lived in this little, a 10 by 10 log cabin that was built in the twenties. And, you know, it was, uh, it was really, I drove his cattle truck and the cattle truck we use to drop high school kids off at, um, at trailheads to go backpacking. And I, I found this picture a number of years ago and I’m hanging out of the side of the truck. And what was really cool was I looked at him, my younger 21, 22 year old self.

Jim Rembach (20:44):

And I started to have some dialogue with him of like,

Aaron McHugh (20:48):

Hey, can you remind me, what did we intend when we intended our career, like our life? What did, what were we setting out to do here? Like, because in the beginning before the road got steep and Rocky and complicated and complex with 401ks and college savings and braces and all that kind of stuff and mortgage payments,

Jim Rembach (21:09):

There was a through line

Aaron McHugh (21:11):

Of like passion and purpose and impact and people. And I just feel like I needed that four by five version of myself to be friend him again, and to ask him to come back into my life. Like, can we do this together? Cause I feel a little in over my head right now, and this is, uh, less so today, but it’s still, we still have some dialogue. So we have made friends again and I’ve reclaimed a lot of those original, like original design of what we were intending to do.

Jim Rembach (21:43):

And I think this probably links into, um, what you had referenced as being the hardest chapter you wrote in the book. Um, so tell us a little bit about why w which one it was and why it was so difficult.

Aaron McHugh (21:56):

Yeah, probably is. I think about it. I’ll be curious if it’s the one that you’re thinking of too. I wrote a chapter on blame and as I wrote the chapter, I don’t remember at the top of my head, which number it is right now, but it basically is titled what’s wrong with the world. And I didn’t want to write it. I kept attempting to take it out of the outline of the book. And the bottom line is I’m not very proud of this, but I find that I can quickly go to blaming others. And Bernay Brown used this phrase. I actually just found this like in a really small little, like two minute video that she used, what she said, the problem with blamers is that we rarely take accountability and responsibility for our own actions. And that blame is the projection of pain is the projection and assignment of pain on someone else.

Aaron McHugh (22:50):

When I read that, listen to her, say that, I thought, Oh gosh, man. Talk about guilty, like guilty. Yes. I raised my hand that’s me. So the reason it was hard for me to write was not only, I didn’t, I didn’t want to admit it and I didn’t want to be seen as a blamer, but I recognized in vulnerability, like that’s the honest truth that had really gotten me in a lot of pickles in my life and stuck places of my own doing secondly, to that, I really wanted to believe that 99% of the people listening to us right now and watching this don’t struggle with it at all. So I was like, why, why drag ever, you know, the 1% of the people who are, blamers why drag them through it, if it’s an unnecessary chapter for them. And what’s really funny is now I’ve found like, Oh, there’s a lot more blamers than the one that I, I, I thought might be out there. So I’d love to hear from you your thoughts on it.

Jim Rembach (23:50):

First of all, it was your lucky number seven chapter. And I mean, for me, I found that I have some that tendency, but then I also started looking at quite frankly, a struggle that I have with that with my oldest son, um, where he wants to do exactly that it’s, you know, everybody else’s problem. And one of the things that you also talk about it in that particular chapter that I think I see, you know, him and maybe others see this too, is that is their way of actually maintaining control. Um, so if I’m blaming everybody else for the things that aren’t going, right, it’s not my issue, man. Cause I’ve got my stuff under control. Well, so the reality is that you spent three days doing something that should’ve lasted 30 minutes, and now you missed your assignment and you’re late, right? It’s like, why did you lower grade? I mean, it was all your fault, man,

Aaron McHugh (24:38):

Which is, you just proved in that little example, that’s, Bernay Brown’s quote is that rarely do blamers take accountability and responsibility for their actions. And that was me. That was a, I was the, uh, okay,

Jim Rembach (24:51):

Well, and the reality is that when you start talking about this, um, you know, people call it VUCA world, right. You know, volatile, unpredictable, and all of that is that, you know, there’s more unpredictability. That’s going to increase at an ever increasing rate. And so therefore, if I am a blamer, what are you really going to control nothing.

Aaron McHugh (25:08):

Right. And I love that question of control is that, to me, it became really helpful when I retired the blame card, then enabled me to do two things is for one, it enabled for me to look inward and look at what is, what is possibly my contribution to this circumstance, this relationship, this story, this career upset, this personal relationship thing. Secondly, it also enabled me to, once I had greater ownership over my own actions, behaviors, and choices, then it was much easier to be clear about what other people’s choices and actions are. And I can say, listen, there can be a line of delineation between me and them or me in the circumstances or me in this outcome. And so I became much more neutral and much less emotionally charged, um, and much less fixed on outcomes. And more back to that, those kind of small, like we, we call it in my hula hoop. Like if you stay on with inside of hula hoop, like this is mine and this is what I can control. And there’s all kinds of stuff outside of my hula hoop. I don’t have a lot of control over and I can influence it though. So being clear about what’s the difference between control and influence.

Jim Rembach (26:24):

Well, and so I think part of that is also, um, you did it as an experiment and you shared your experiment and you talked about eight magnificent people. So tell us a little bit about that.

Aaron McHugh (26:36):

Yeah. I’d come back from a training in Europe and number of the people that I was there with colleagues, they all these individual coaching practices and they were talking about how much they learned from these coaches coaching clients. And so I’m like, Oh, that’s easy. I think I’ll just, I’m going to fire up and an experiment. I’m going to try something. So I sent out this email, I wrote it in the morning and I just had these like three or four questions. Like, do you think there’s something really important that you’re here to do? And with your life, you don’t know what it is or you know what it is and you get stuck. You really aren’t sure what to do next and how to take the next step. And you’d like help and a guide. And like, it was just super simple. Like that wrote, it, sent it, send it to, you know, 1500 people or something.

Aaron McHugh (27:23):

And I couldn’t believe it was like by far, still the most responded to email I’ve ever sent. And I had all these people coming in. So I said, I’m looking for eight people and I’m going to run an experiment. It’s going to be six weeks long. And we’re going to have some conversations about these kinds of topics. So I ended up through application process selecting these magic eight, magnificent eight. And we embarked on this journey of, uh, you know, I said, it wasn’t, it wasn’t counseling or therapy, but at moments we got deep, you know, it was, but it was asking big questions like, well, how do you know what it is you’re here to do? And we go back to that four by five, you know, the picture of myself, like in the beginning, what did you believe? Because I, what I find is like part of the tragedy for me, and this is like just a human condition.

Aaron McHugh (28:13):

I can’t stand the idea like at a soulful heart level, that 70% of people go to work every day in some degree of despair or apathy. And so to me, it’s like, I’m going to make, I’m going to take a swing at engaging more people. Well, let’s start with, what, what do you love? What do you care about? What do you think the difference is here to make? If we put aside like the cultural, conventional wisdom, like buy as much stuff as you can buy as big a house, you know, like binge watch every TV show, like, hold on, time out, let’s pin those aside. Let’s go back to the beginning. And so it was really cool. We got to do this journey together. And then what I was able to do is then distill back to that narration. I could go back and like narrate, Oh, now here’s eight people, their experiences.

Aaron McHugh (29:03):

And they were everything from like screenwriters in Hollywood to, um, multibillion dollar, um, sales executives in terms of portfolios that they manage in tech to a local, like a local, um, how an executive coach to it was real myriad to a yoga teacher. So it was really cool, like holistic view of these different people’s lives. And I curated that on purpose. And the biggest thing I was looking for was like, who are people are going to be all in? Like they’re going to be authentic, real, transparent, vulnerable. And then how can we then like journey together to like pick our way through this? So it became super fascinating. And for me, it deepened my conviction to see that here’s a sample size of eight, and this is from exact to, you know, a low level engineer. The, everybody wants to actually do better. They want to get out of bed.

Aaron McHugh (30:01):

They want to feel like what they do matters. They want to feel like who they are like with confidence in, you know, from an identity standpoint. And then all of them had some sort of like spiritual life too. They had something that connected them to a deeper purpose, a deeper, you know, I, I just asked the question, like, where do you go when you need help? Um, and I found that these people, they had an answer to that. Oftentimes people when they don’t have an answer to that, I find that that just adds to their struggle.

Jim Rembach (30:34):

Well, even as you’re talking, I’m thinking to myself, we need to do a better job of trying to help our younger generation to accomplish what you were just talking about, you know, and have that discovery and to learn places to go and to be able to understand that they need to find a purpose because if not, then it becomes the whole self absorption knows in a device thing. Um, that’s what they struggle with. But you, so you talk about actually living by degrees and tri what does that mean?

Aaron McHugh (31:02):

Yeah. So Jim, I spend a lot of time in the wilderness, like I mentioned, and a compass is to me is like a literal tool I use. And then it’s a, an analogy based tool. So what’s cool about a compass is that when you adjust it by a degree, so it’s, you know, 180 degrees would be in the opposite direction. Two degrees. I went to this, um, this week long program in a place called, uh, onsite workshops in Nashville years ago. And one of the directors talked about, we’re not attempting to make 90 degree turns 180 degree turns. All we’re trying to do is do two degree adjustments. And I remember thinking like, well, what good would that do? Like that’s so nonsensically small. But then I realized like, Oh, but in the wilderness, if I actually adjust two degrees, now, if I walk half a mile, it’s not a big deal, but you walk 50 miles and two degrees a long way.

Aaron McHugh (32:02):

So I have this friend who was a FedEx pilot during his life, a career life. And he was telling me about, Oh, two degrees is a big deal. As a pilot, you fly from LA to Hawaii. And two degrees. You will miss. If you’re off by two degrees, you will miss the Hawaiian islands by 80 miles. You will be lost at sea. So to me, it was like, Oh, okay. That really helps me shrink back to what can I do every day? What are the micro adjustments? The micro habits, the small tilts in the direction I want to head. And then that try is experimentation. It’s just, you gotta to try something new. Um, there’s a great book out that I’ve been reading, it’s called, uh, designing your work life. And it’s a SQL to designing your life. And these two Stanford professors, they talk a lot about design thinking.

Aaron McHugh (32:58):

And one of the big things is you have to try new things. You have to experiment, you have to prototype. And so for me, like today, I just, before I got on with you, um, one thing I started, I think it’s 105 days ago was running one mile every day as just an eight minute miniature experiment. It’s one mile, it’s a super low bar and it’s something I can do every day. And it’s not 10 miles. It’s not three miles every other day. It’s one mile every day. And my goal is to just sequence this. Like, let’s see how far I can take this. And I don’t have a destination in mind, but what I know is like, I want to be fit. And when I hit 50 years old, like couple of years from now, like, I want to feel like I’m 36. So like, those are the small little incremental things I can do. So that’s that degrees and try.

Jim Rembach (33:44):

Well, and the, I think that the two degrees shift is a heck of a lot easier than, you know, something that’s more significant by far. Um, uh, cause I think also too, one of the issues associated, especially if you go into, you know, backpacking and orienteering is if you increase that you ended up going in circles, right? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. That’s good.

Aaron McHugh (34:04):

Even though those, yeah, those are exactly. And the big thing is that what I want people to feel is I want people to feel empowered, to start with the life that you have today, the career that you have today, the place that you stand today, which is why I say don’t quit your job, stay where you are and start the revolution with small increments of try and experimentation and two little degree adjustments. The same thing you always do, just try one thing this week, that’s different. And over time I can attest and many others can how that builds over time.

Jim Rembach (34:41):

Well, but then you also talk about giving your loyal soldier, the boots. So how does that fit in?

Aaron McHugh (34:46):

Yeah. I love that you have the loyal soldier was another Richard Rohr reference is he told a story about when soldiers, Japanese soldiers came back from world war II. And one of the things that they did culturally was actually had a ceremony and they, they actually said, okay, welcome back. Thank you so much for what you’ve done in your service when you were away at war. And now we’re asking you to retire your loyal soldier. Thank him. Her bless him, her for all the great work they did. And now it’s time for you to take your seat back in your life here with us in our community. So as a school teacher, as a surgeon, as a husband, as a son, as a daughter, and I found that of like, Whoa, so what do you talked about is the challenge is when we have, for each of us, their stories that were installed in, in us along the way that are part of our operating system.

Aaron McHugh (35:51):

So for me, an example is, uh, my parents split up when I was 12 years old. I’m the oldest of three and this really well-intended family friend was at our house. And he put his arm around me and said, you’re the man of the house. Now when I was 12. And what I did with that over the course of my life was I owned that and that became, um, distorted. So that story became no help is coming you’re on your own. And if it’s to be, then it’s up to you. So what I found was that loyal soldier, part of me who was really beautiful, worked really hard, got a lot of stuff done, made a big impact. And it gotten me this far was also contributing to being tired, exhausted, frustrated, alone. So what I realized was, uh, so some people that use the framing of false self and true self there’s, lots of frames that go with this, but the loyal soldier is I actually sat down and wrote a letter to my loyal soldier and included it in the book.

Aaron McHugh (37:00):

And again, very vulnerably of saying like, this is what my loyal soldier has told me in the past to be true. And what I loved was the pivot was, and now I’m going to be led by love. And that was a fundamental different like versus scarcity scarcity is what led a lot of my story, a lot of the way and versus abundance, love, possibility, creativity. So that was where I really just kind of have like a, yeah. A ceremony of thank you very much for your service. Thank you for giving me this, getting me this far and now I’m going to take it from here and it’s going to be great.

Jim Rembach (37:38):

Oh, without a doubt. I mean, you’ve poured a lot of inspiration, you know, even into this episode and it’s all loaded in your book through all these stories and, you know, you’ve found more inspiration as you’ve gone on your journey. And one of the things that we look at on the show to help us hold onto and grab and garner some of that inspiration, our quotes, is there a quote or two that you’d like to

Aaron McHugh (37:56):

Did you can share? Oh yeah, I would love that. Grab it. So one of my favorites is from a author Ann Lamont and she wrote a book, a chicken noodle soup for the soul, I think is what her book is. So she wrote almost everything will work again, if you unplug it for a few minutes, including you. So that’s definitely one of my favorites. Um, yeah, that’s the one that’s probably top of mind for me right now.

Jim Rembach (38:32):

Well, thanks for sharing that. Um, uh, there’s so many different to that. That’s what I have.

Aaron McHugh (38:38):

Um, so w w you know, you shared even just hear a whole lot of stories when we talk about getting over the hump on the show, cause people can learn from those. But if you could, if you can just give us some detail on one, uh, instance where you’ve gotten over the hump so that we can learn from it. Yeah. That’s a good question. I think one of the biggest pivots in the beginning, a buddy of mine came over to my house. Um, things were difficult in my career. Things were difficult in our marriage. Things were difficult with our kids, our daughter’s health at the time, and she was still alive. And he said, you know what? You might not be able to change your circumstance, but you can own your atmosphere because yeah, like the atmosphere, the atmosphere of your home, like the atmosphere of you, like your emotional, physical, spiritual, mental health wellness.

Aaron McHugh (39:32):

And that really was perplexing to me because I had no idea what he was talking about at first. And he actually just dropped off some CDs back in, it was a CD era. Uh, the made me some music. He’s like, I really encourage you to marinate, like put these on, listen to these and wake up in the morning, put in the little earphones and start with this. And it really changed everything for me of this idea of what if I own the atmosphere of my life, like my physical, emotional, spiritual wellbeing, um, my attitude, my outlooks. Um, and then how do I expand that into my domain? My areas of influence. So I would say that for me, like getting start small two degree tries, like I meditate. Most days I use Headspace app, you know, it’s 10 minutes. Um, I start my day in quiet, um, prayer and meditation every day I run like, but these are small little things like these don’t take a lot of time. So I just found that if, if I can start there, I think Tim Ferriss uses the phrase. If you can win the morning, you can win the day. So anything like that, where you can take agency ownership over what’s in front of you right now, then everything else from there becomes much easier. So most definitely the fast leader Legion wishes you the very best. Now, before we move on, let’s get a quick word from our sponsor. And even better place

Jim Rembach (41:00):

Is an easy solution that gives you a continuous diagnostic on employee engagement, along with integrated activities that will improve employee engagement and leadership skills in everyone. Using this award winning solutions guaranteed to create motivated, productive, and loyal employees who have great work relationships with our colleagues and your customers to learn more about an even better place to work visit [inaudible] dot com forward slash better. Alright, here we go. Fastly to Legion. It’s time for the home. Oh, now, okay. Erin, the hub they hold on is the part of our show where you give us good insights fast. So I’m going to ask you several questions and your job is to give us a robust, you have rapid responses that are gonna help us move onward and upward faster. Aaron McHugh. Are you ready to go down? Let’s do it. Alright. So what is holding you back from being an even better leader today?

Aaron McHugh (41:45):

I care too much about whether people think,

Jim Rembach (41:47):

What is the best leadership advice I’ve ever received

Aaron McHugh (41:51):

Say, I’m sorry.

Jim Rembach (41:52):

What is one of your secrets that you believe contributes to your success?

Aaron McHugh (41:57):

I believe in God.

Jim Rembach (41:58):

And what do you believe is one of your best tools that helps you lead in business or life?

Aaron McHugh (42:03):

I mean, eternally optimistic

Jim Rembach (42:05):

And what is one book that you’d recommend to our Legion? It could be from any genre. Of course, we’re going to put a link to fire your boss on your show notes page as well,

Aaron McHugh (42:13):

Essentialism by Greg McKeown, disciplined pursuit of less.

Jim Rembach (42:16):

Okay. Fastly Allegion. You can find links to that. And other bonus information from today’s show by going to fast leader.net/aaron and that’s AA McHugh. And that’s M C H U G H. Okay. Aaron, this is my last hook down. Hope they hold on question. Imagine you were given the opportunity to go back to the age of 25 and you can take the knowledge and skills that you have now back with you, but you can’t take it all. You can only take one. So what skill or piece of knowledge would you take back with you and why

Aaron McHugh (42:44):

From today? I get to transport back to 25 and what’s the wisdom I would take. Yep. Great question. I think something about that. My wife is right more than she’s wrong. I think I just believe that like that 25 year old guy didn’t believe it.

Jim Rembach (43:03):

Thanks for sharing your knowledge and wisdom. How can the fast leader Legion get in touch with you?

Aaron McHugh (43:08):

Yeah. All things. AaronMcHugh.com. You can grab a free chapter of my book there. It’s under keep going as a way to pace yourself and yeah, there’ll be podcasts there and guides, all that good stuff.

Jim Rembach (43:22):

Thank you for sharing that knowledge and wisdom, and we’ll continue to stay in contact with you. And thank you for helping us all get over the hump.

290: Gregg Ward – Leadership is About Respect

290: Gregg Ward – Leadership is About Respect

Gregg Ward was working with a colleague who he became best buddies with. They would hang out, party, and spend time together, but after some performance slip-ups, Gregg (who was the leader of the organization) was put in a position where he needed to deal with the issues that his friend was having at work. Because their relationship was not based on respect, his colleague did not agree with his decision and things went ugly from there. From that mistake Gregg realized how important respect is between any relationship whether personal or professional.

289: Alan Willett – Leading with Speed

289: Alan Willett – Leading with Speed

Alan Willett was employed in a corporation and felt miserable about the job. Then, he came to a realization that all the work that he was doing was actually for himself and the greater good. Having shifted his mindset, Alan Willett returned to his work having the ability to say no and not just doing everything they wanted him to do. Alan took ownership of his job and the results went really well.

288: Louis Carter – Leading Great Companies and Sparking Peak Performance

288: Louis Carter – Leading Great Companies and Sparking Peak Performance

Louis Carter Show Notes Page

Louis Carter was working for a group of people who locked him in an office to do all of their work until three in the morning. He tried to escape, but the door was locked and there was an alarm in the way. He didn’t have a key and didn’t know the code. He was able to get out with a little help from the police. Through that experience, Louis vouched to never work again for somebody like that. He confronted them and left the group and was able to get over the hump.

Louis Carter was born and raised in Waterford, CT, a small suburb of New London, CT, an even smaller city in Southeastern, CT.  He has one sister, and his parents were divorced at age 20.

In his Freshman year at Brown University, Lou’s best friend committed suicide. This experience changed him forever, and he vouched that he never wanted another friend or person to have the same fate as his friend.

As a way to begin this process, Lou transferred to Connecticut College to focus on his long-time studies of Economics and Government with a focus on social systems and how governments form and effect organizational systems and economies.

Lou was always involved as the President of his class, and founder of new organizations on campus at school that fought for the rights of students – to be heard, respected, and understood.  When he was hired by the President of the college, Claire Gaudiani, to lead a professor development program, he knew he could make the most change.

In the program, he focused on helping professors respect differences as well as create and drive a positive vision for the future. His first job out of college in his early career, he worked at Gemini Consulting (now owned by Ernst and Young) as a strategic analyst. He quickly found out that this was not bringing him closer to his purpose of helping leaders understand their immense power to influence the lives of thousands of people for the better.

From there, he became a product development specialist at Linkage, Inc., where he became a product development specialist and later became their VP of Research. It was here that he worked with the leading industry experts to bring their work to life – including the late Warren Bennis, Richard Beckhard, and luminaries such as Edgar Schein, Marshall Goldsmith, John Kotter, and Chris Argyris.

He created one of the first global leadership development competency programs. He was able to work with leaders like Benjamin Netanyahu, Senator George Mitchell, Bhenzair Bhutto, Hunter “Patch” Adams, and others who fought for the rights of their people – with grace, compassion, and respect.

This inspired him to write the best practice book series for John Wiley and Sons – which included all of the best-in-class leadership development, learning, and talent management programs and practices from around the world with Blue Chip and Fortune 500 companies like Pfizer, Volvo, Boeing, Corning, Allstate, GlaxoSmithKline, Bose, Motorola, BP, Colgate, Microsoft, the IRS and 100s more.

It was his lifelong purpose to help others create a culture of respect and positive vision of the future that brought him to write his most recent book: In Great Company: how to spark peak performance by creating an emotionally connected culture.

Lou is a family man – and spends as much time as he can with his family – they are an integral part of his life, and he considers them to be his most important legacy.  In Lou’s opinion, there is no greater purpose or legacy in life than family, and the support system you build around them – community, teachers, coaches and extended network that develops them to become the very best in life.

Tweetable Quotes and Mentions

Listen to @louislcarter get over the hump on the @FastLeaderShowClick to Tweet

“Be careful of what you think because it will affect what you say. Be careful of what you say because it will affect what you do.” – Click to Tweet

“The number one way to collaborate systemically is through co-creation.” – Click to Tweet

“Co-creation means that you have a vision for what you want to create inside of your organization.” – Click to Tweet

“When you have a positive vision, you can move forward a lot better and people all know where you’re going and what you’re doing.” – Click to Tweet

“When people know your values, people align with those values.” – Click to Tweet

“Respect is a currency that you give and get back.” – Click to Tweet

“Friendship for engagement. It’s not about friendship, it’s about respect.” – Click to Tweet

“Great leaders have all the great competencies, and when they have clear vision and collaboration, their outcomes are going to be great.” – Click to Tweet

“Affective commitment is about how we feel when we’re committed. If we are affectively committed, then we want to be at our peak performance.” – Click to Tweet

“For resilient organizations, the one rule they adhere to is embracing failure to leverage the learning.” – Click to Tweet

Hump to Get Over

Louis Carter was working for a group of people who locked him in an office to do all of their work until three in the morning. He tried to escape, but the door was locked and there was an alarm in the way. He didn’t have a key and didn’t know the code. He was able to get out with a little help from the police. Through that experience, Louis vouched to never work again for somebody like that. He confronted them and left the group and was able to get over the hump.

Advice for others

Invest in stocks and real estate.

Holding him back from being an even better leader

Emotion regulation.

Best Leadership Advice

Take it easy, be cool.

Secret to Success

Heart and passion.

Best tools in business or life

Relationships and accountability partners

Recommended Reading

In Great Company: How to Spark Peak Performance By Creating an Emotionally Connected Workplace

The Alchemist

Contacting Louis Carter

Lou’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/louislcarter

Lou’s Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/louiscarter.bpi

Lou’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louiscarter/

Lou’s website: https://louiscarter.com/

Best Practice Institute: https://www.bestpracticeinstitute.org/

Results-based Culture: https://resultsbasedculture.com/

Resources

Lou’s YouTube page: https://www.youtube.com/c/LouisCarterChange

Show Transcript

Click to access unedited transcript

Unedited Transcript

Jim Rembach (00:00):

Okay, fast leader Legion today. I’m excited because I have Lou Carter on the show today and Lou is really going to give us some good perspectives on how we can make it a connection in a, from a, from an organizational perspective, that’s really going to assist in our performance and help us link all that together. Cause oftentimes when we start talking about culture and things like that, we often don’t see how we can actually make it, uh, and how to get those high-performance impacts that we want. Lou Carter was born and raised in Waterford, Connecticut, small suburb of new London, Connecticut, and even smaller city of Southeastern Connecticut. He has one sister and his parents were divorced at age 20, but in his freshman year at Brown university lose breath, boot, best friend actually committed suicide. And it was this experience that changed him forever.

Jim Rembach (00:49):

And he vouched that he never wanted another friend or person to have the same fate as his friend. And as a way to begin this process, Lou transferred to Connecticut college to focus on his longtime studies of economics and government with a focus on social systems and how governments form and affect organizational systems and economies. Lou was always involved as the president of his class and founder of new organizations on campus at school that fought for the rights of students to be heard, respected and understood when he was hired by the president of the college, Claire Gaudium Guardini to lead a professorship development program. He knew he could make a significant change in the program. He focused on helping professors respect differences, as well as create and drive a positive vision for the future. His first job out of college and his early career, he worked at Gemini consulting, which is now owned by Ernst and young as a strategic analyst.

Jim Rembach (01:46):

He quickly found out that this was not bringing him closer to his purpose of helping leaders understand their immense power to influence the lives of thousands of people. For the better. From there, he became a product development specialist at linkage, inc, where he became a product development specialist and later became their VP of research. It was here that he worked with the leading industry experts to bring their work life, including the late Warren Bennis, Richard Becker, and the luminaries shut Edgar Schein, Marshall Goldsmith, John Kotter, and Chris arduous. He created one of the first global leadership development competency programs, and he was able to work with leaders like Benjamin Netanyahu, Senator George Mitchell, Benzir Bhutto Hunter patch, Adams, and others who fought for the rights of their people with grace, compassion and respect. This inspired him to write the best practice book series for John Wiley and sons, which included all of the best in class leadership, development, learning and talent management programs and practices from around the world with blue chip and fortune 500 companies like Pfizer, Volvo, Boeing, Corning, Allstate GlaxoSmithKline, Bose, Motorola, BP Colgate, Microsoft, the IRS and hundreds more.

Jim Rembach (03:01):

It was his lifelong purpose to help others create a culture of respect and positive vision of the future to have brought him to write his most recent book in great company, how to spark peak performance by creating an emotionally connected culture. Lou is a family man and spends much of his time possible with his family and they are an integral part of his life. And he considers them to be as most important legacy and Lou’s opinion. There’s no greater purpose or legacy in life and family and the supporting system you build around them, community coaches, teachers, and extended network that develops them to become the very best in life. Lou Carter, are you ready to help us get over the hump?

Louis Carter (03:37):

I love that. I did. Jim. It’s awesome to be here today and thank you so much for having me. I appreciate that. Awesome introduction to it. Thank you.

Jim Rembach (03:45):

Well, thanks for giving me the opportunity and being here on the show. Now I’ve given my Legion a little bit about you, but can you share what your current passion is so that we can get to know you even better?

Louis Carter (03:54):

Sure. Yeah. My current pression is working with, um, organizations, especially healthcare clinics and really helping them to, uh, to grow and uh, come from sort of from here to there, right? Because healthcare clinics and healthcare right now today, they are in a very challenging position because patients are coming back and they there’s, uh, elective surgeries that people aren’t don’t feel that comfortable doing. And a there’s also COVID and pandemic that they’re dealing with. And we have to look ahead. So it’s the healthcare clinics that are creating those external collaborations and the leaders at the top. We’re really doing extraordinary things to get those clinics back up and running. So my passion is working with those Todd, the CEO, CFO, COO. I just love it and their board and bringing them to a place where they can create awesome practices to serve patients to their best possible level.

Jim Rembach (04:51):

Well, needless to say, that’s a very important mission that you currently are undertaking. And for me, when I started Lexton going through the book, I didn’t have that context. So thanks you for sharing. And I think that brings things on a very, very different light, um, because oftentimes we have a separation, especially in those environments, you know, because we have the pressures of all the finance elements, you know, with the caring elements and that, that, that oftentimes creates a whole lot of friction that we don’t want to have. But you talk about four very important benefits of emotional connectedness and they are that it fulfills intrinsic needs. It makes emotional intelligence more actionable. It creates psychological safety and it drives discretionary effort. Now, how did you come up with these four?

Louis Carter (05:40):

Yeah, so we, we did a survey and a bunch of primary interviews, a bunch of surveys and ask people, what is it that’s going to make you love your workplace and do even more that’s the voluntary discretionary effort. And then the psychological safety came in because they said, well, how am I to create moral? I’d feel safe talking and why it’s that I’m not harmed or lose my position if I don’t, if I don’t, uh, if I say the wrong things and it wasn’t just about psychological safety, it’s that intrinsic reward system that’s intrinsically what will drive me to do these things. And what we’ve found that drives people to do, things has more to do with practices and behaviors, things that you do and others do around you that enable you to really just skyrocket. And in the absence of these behaviors, you can’t, it doesn’t matter how great of an accountant you are upgrade of a technology technologist. You are strategist just doesn’t matter if you don’t have them, your team suffers your organization suffers

Jim Rembach (06:43):

Well and you, and to give it justice. I mean, in the book, you actually break down all of these particular elements, these four now benefits, and you go into that detail to a greater degree. But here’s the thing that I find quite interesting in what you shared though, is the whole whole self-reporting element of, you know, what I feel. And, and even if why I feel it. So how do you actually prevent people? Just saying things that they may think is the right thing to say without actually connecting with them as an individual?

Louis Carter (07:16):

Hmm. So a lot of people have, they have two responses or two ways of thinking. Some are physical thinkers and others are more cognitive focused and they actually have to think through things before they say them. So physical thinkers just immediately blurt things out and they’re reactive and this kind of self reflection, self reflection, self awareness of how they’re talking and how it has an effect on the others is an enormously, incredibly important competency to have to be emotionally connected because it allows us to take us a breather, a meditative step to download information. And there’s known to be terabytes of information that comes into your brain all at once from you share information terabytes, you think about those no longer can give gigabytes terabytes. And the question is, how do we do, how do we take that information and then give it to you, give it to others that are, that are hearing us in a simple way. So we’re not just reactive thinkers, we’re thinkers who can take a tremendous amount of data and provide it back in a simple way that other people can receive it, just so that it’s not so harmful or hurtful, even

Jim Rembach (08:30):

Really interesting that you say that. Um, because for me I’m like, okay, you’re data driven, right? You’re all about analytics and understanding the analytics and being able to use them in order to be able to affect these drivers. Right. Um, be able to go in and modify certain behaviors. I mean, all of those types of things. So what I was referring to and your response or what I was necessarily looking for. So that’s why I’m asking a different way. And I appreciate you allowing me to do that is I’m asking somebody, these things in regards to what would fulfill your interest. I mean, all of those things and for us as individuals, a lot of times we can’t necessarily, you know, know why, right. We can, we don’t understand that. So how do you make sure that your data isn’t tainted, um, because, and start doing something that really isn’t going to have impact. Yep.

Louis Carter (09:20):

So, so we have something called the ladder of inference. So, uh, and, and, uh, were you in the middle and sort of the bottom of the ladder is, is data. It’s raw data. It’s things that we hear. It could be anything. This is why I’m here. You know, I’m saying something to us and it’s things that we just automatically take. And it just that thousand people in their own mental models can take it different ways. And you walk up the ladder and you suddenly you get to environment, right? That’s some of the things that you believe in sort of environment. And you’ve been talking about and, and judgments and search kinda the judgment portion. If he gets to know how you grow up and what are, what are the things that, uh, affect your perceptions and, um, and your experiences. And, um, those kinds of things have impact and often they’re triggers.

Louis Carter (10:09):

So these are triggers that you’ve had from inside of your life that can trigger a response in your mind. And to calm that response is very important because they affect your judgment, which affects your actions. And one of my good friends, Frances Hesselbein once I was at a meeting with her, she’s a former CEO of girl Scouts of America. She came out to me. I don’t know why she did this, but I was sitting there at the meeting. She says, be careful of what you think, because they’ll affect what you say, be careful what you say, because they affect what you do. And she came in and she’s, she’s 102 years old, by the way. And she sit her in my ear and I went like that. I couldn’t believe it. I said, Oh, she’s talking about the letter of inference. It’s like, I put it in the book and it affected me. It touched me because I know think that when I have experiences, when something, I say, well, maybe this is triggering me. Maybe I need to think of it in a different way. Maybe need to expose her open myself.

Jim Rembach (11:11):

Oh, thank you for sharing that. Okay. So then what we’re, what you’re talking about is by having those four benefits that actually result in five elements that spark a peak performance, and it’s an acronym. So it’s systematic collaboration, positive future alignment of values, respect, and killer achievement. And so again, I have to say that this is probably evidence-based right.

Louis Carter (11:37):

It is evidence-based exactly. And, and one of the things that it, it came from, it was spark from, was an experiment by Arthur Aron’s, um, BA back a long while ago, seventies, it was called the love experiment. And, uh, the love experiment was when two people come together and they basically look at each other, not too long after three minutes, it starts to get kind of freaky. Uh, but, uh, for, for both three or four minutes, really, and then they ask each other a series of questions and those questions largely have to do with these five areas that came up in the survey. When we asked, what’s going to make you feel really comfortable and want to produce even more for your company. So this, these questions, these five areas are very much attributed to work or attribute to life are attributed to any environment that you’re in and I can go through them and explain them for you

Speaker 3 (12:36):

Most definitely.

Louis Carter (12:38):

So, so I’ll start it out. The first part of it is systemic collaboration. And in our lives, we have a family, we have extended family, we have coaches, we have people all around us and that’s part of our system and how we collaborate with them. And we listen and we give, and we form alliances and structures. And we’re very honest and open about what things are, and being also generous with our humor, or even if we need, if we need to in a way, and being kind of just, uh, there for people on a, on a, on a personal level and resonate with them is all as part of systemic collaboration. So if you approach that for your company too, it’s the same, right? So if you’re CEO of a company, you form relationships with other, perhaps even competitors, people who could, uh, who you can help to get even to a higher level because of the reality that they need to, uh, they need to come to terms with, or they should come to terms with.

Louis Carter (13:36):

And that often happens. Um, and also for people who are part of the extension, essentially on the side of the government or local, all these relationships that happen. And then inside the company, how does the board work with the executive team, the executive team with the different divisions, all the way down to the magic middle of the company and to the, and to the customers themselves. So these are, this is the system. This is how we collaborate. And the number one way you collaborate systemically in our, in our world of, in great company, emotional connectedness is co-creation, co-creation means that you have a vision and that’s the second part is his positive future. You have that positive future, that vision for what you want to create inside of your organization or inside your family or your life. And that is very clear. You present it, you create it with others through inquiry, questions, and advocacy, advocating what you want your future to be what that inner diamond is really of what that future should be.

Louis Carter (14:39):

And that becomes what you create within your system, in your strategy for your system. I’ll talk a little bit more about that, and you can go through the five and I can explain it a little more. Um, so you, if you look at that, that inner diamond, that kind of where you’re at, what your vision is, think of a example of a case for it. So Hugh bear Jolie is the CEO of best buy, uh, when Spencer Stewart brought them in, brought him in, uh, that’s my children. Uh, do you want me to pause it for a second? And I, can you hear them? Uh, let me just tell them, tell my wife, Hey, paint a second.

Louis Carter (15:26):

So one of the parts that we were talking about was positive future and Hubert. Julie is the CEO of best, who was a CEO of best buy. He was brought in by Jim Citron, from Spencer Stuart, who is a CEO executive search consultant. And Jim looks for one thing when he brings in new CEO’s vision. If you have a really strong, compelling vision that will bring the company from here to where they want to go, which is essentially a best buy. They wanted to go from being a showcase to being profitable because the best buy people were coming in, they looked like a showcase, a showroom. They were taking pictures and looking at barcodes, and then they were looking up on Amazon and other places and figuring out, I don’t really need these things or buy these seats here. So who bear said, I’ve got a vision for the board.

Louis Carter (16:13):

And he said, this said, I want to make you and everybody here, a community I want to, I want to create a way for us to help our customers and for them to stay in the store as long as we can, so they can make a possible purchase and not leave the store, find a better price, but be with us as a community, created the geek squad, of course, and everybody knows, and the rest is history. They’ve been, become very successful and profitable as result. Same is true of positive vision. When you have this positive vision inches, the key and the spark, you can move forward a lot better, and people all know where you’re going and what you’re on, what you’re doing.

Louis Carter (16:54):

Go to the AA, right? So the alignment of values. So planet value is important because when people know your values, especially at the top, and they know what you respect and what your, your boundaries are and what you want in life and what, and how you, and what, you know, your strengths as well, what your strengths are and areas you can improve on. So you’ve had, self-awareness people align with those values and the right people come as well. And it’s easy to spot people who do not align with those values so that we can help them either develop those values as competencies, actual behaviors, or choose. Maybe it’s not the right place for them. And that’s okay, no guilt, no blame. So always no guilt mode blame. We find places where we should be, and we’re where life is good for everyone. And I would say that you have to create a world of work where everyone wins.

Louis Carter (17:44):

So that’s alignment of values. My values align with your values. We find out a commonality in this, in a spark relationship and a spark conversation. It’s always there, whether it be, this is something I share, this is something you share could come from our background, could come something from your family, my family, something I’ve experienced, you’ve experienced that kind of commonality, same thing for studios, same thing for really anyone in relationships. So the, the R is, is a, is a fun one. Uh, and I get a lot of questions about it because there’s so much controversy over respect, which is funny. It’s, it’s an enormous, it’s like one of the biggest possible subjects. We’re actually, we’re going to call the book respect because we had so much consternation and questioning about it. And here’s why there, we’ve seen so much question about it because people’s definition of it is very different.

Louis Carter (18:38):

So they say, well, I expect respect, right? And I have to have respect before they even give respect. And we found that respect is actually a currency, something you give and then get back of. And we also found it to be there’s reciprocal as a system, you give it, you get it. These aren’t, these are very, uh, you know, complex topics, right? We give respect, get respect here for years, but happening since the beginning of time during, you know, Machiavelli eye for an eye to the right or the history of time has happened. What’s different though about it is that we took the concept of friendship as being needed for engagement, which we don’t. We’re not about engagement in this book. We’re about doing more and feeling more connected and actually creating peak performance friendship for engagement. It’s not about friendship. It’s about respect. And the example is Jackie Robinson was greatest baseball player of all time.

Louis Carter (19:34):

We know you’re a coach too. So you, I believe he was like, we’re created spiteful players all the time. When he was, when he played baseball, people threw tomatoes at him. They booed him. They were disrespectful of him. And he started, he started hitting that ball and making home runs. And he was one of the best baseball players of all time. You know what though? Jackie said to him, I don’t care if you’re my friend, you have to respect me. And that’s the one thing we talk about here is you respect me for who I am and what I, and the fact that I work hard and affect you. You don’t have to go out with me for drinks later or tea, whatever your training, whatever liquid you drink there, just respect me and I’ll go home and I’ll live my life. So that’s what respect means at a deep level for individuals like Jackie was, I like to talk with Jackie in a way to kill her outcomes is really about how, what we do as individuals and what we do as a company, we have to really connect these things.

Louis Carter (20:30):

So as an individual, if I’m the head of accounting, I want to get my numbers in correctly and accurately really it at the end of the day, if that doesn’t happen, there’s gotta be reasons for it. Relationships, collaboration. It’s not a clear vision and understanding of what my values are. All those things are off chance. So that’s why your numbers aren’t coming in well. So that’s, that’s really about outcomes is that it can be misaligned when all those other things are, are not aligned, right? So the same with a COO or CEO, great seat CEO’s, or have all the great competencies and CEOs, and they have that clear vision and collaboration, their outcomes are going to be great. They’re going to get, do great demos. They’re going to get, they get the best possible customer outcomes, same with CEOs, great strategy, great vision, great financial outcomes. That’s it spark.

Jim Rembach (21:23):

And you know, I think you said it several times, so we probably need to hone in on it. And you talk about, you know, leading and being a leader in all of this. And you talked about both individually and collectively, and you mentioned about an emotionally connected leader. They actually have five different elements. Um, they have the systemic collaboration, um, the positive future, the alignment of values, the respect, uh, and then also killer achievement. And, and, you know, you’ve mentioned in sparks some of these things and some of these things, it creates that, uh, or enables, you know, the spark to occur. But, but they’re all important obviously, right. But when I start thinking about, Hey, this one carries heavier weight. I think I know the answer because you kind of talked about it a little bit, but which one is it and why?

Louis Carter (22:12):

Yeah, it’s funny. Like I see it, actually, we always said that there are variables that are all, you know, equally weighted and we equally weighted them in the way that we created the survey. So ideally or scientifically they’re supposed to be all equally weighted. So, so now if you’re going to ask me qual like qualitative me, like which one I think is the most important, that’s a lot different. So I definitely think it’s the respect. And I think it’s about that kind of, that aspect of, you know, what are, what are, what are my values because it runs into everything, right? So the respect is necessary with collaboration with co-creating it’s respect is important for values as well for aligning our values, because we need that established that in order to even get to the second line there. And then, you know, the, the, the aligned values, the positive vision of the future, we still gotta get the respect to get there. And then the outcomes, right? So it’s, it’s really about internal respect, others, respect, group respect, organizational respect, customer respect. It all comes down to that. And respect comes a really is fall usually cause lay, you know, love, appreciation, emotional connectedness, because if I get that very baseline, I can start to formulate deeper, deeper emotions, just like in a relationship.

Jim Rembach (23:37):

Okay. Well, as you’re talking for me, I mean, there are several, you know, light lights that were going off in regards to that. But before I get to that, um, you know, having worked for organika working, worked for an academic for 15 years, you know, the whole multivariate analysis and being remembering what are key drivers and all the becomes important. So even if I have that equal waiting, you know, and I don’t know if you, you, maybe you answered it in a, in a non, uh, analytic way, but there has, there had to be statistically significant, you know, significant impact. And you’re saying, it’s respect.

Louis Carter (24:11):

I am, I really am saying it because if, if we want, we get into the science of it, which is there’s, there’s three things, just psychological safety, organizational, citizenship behaviors, and something called effective commitment. And those are the three scientific concepts with people are interested in the psychology of it that really impacted it. Um, and if you look at those three concepts, there’s one that really kind of blares out, um, psychological safety. You do need respect for it, but the other one is effective commitment. And if you looked up a effective AFF E C T S E effective, the commitment I, uh, to two people admire now, and back in 1991, like, you know, we don’t people who we don’t even know, know who these people are. They’re able one of the most significant studies, I think, in the history of organization development. And they said that effective commitment is how do we feel when we’re committed?

Louis Carter (25:10):

Right? So if we are affectively committed, it means we want to be there. It means we feel respected. We want to be there. We want to be at our peak performance, however, when we have normative. So it’s a three part model it’s effective. Is it the, kind of the best you have normative and commit and continuance normative is this kind of, kind of interesting, it’s kind of a little bit, people have a psychiatric condition to use as normative because it’s the truth. It’s like they’re saying to themselves, they have kind of this ritual thing where it’s like, if I’m not here, something bad will happen to me. That’s what they’re thinking. If I’m not here, something bad will happen to me. And that I, this, I have to keep the norm the status quo and less harm myself. I was going to be harmed. Then there’s continuance, which is continuous is have to cause that’s the only job I have.

Louis Carter (26:06):

I have to continue here. So both our two are forced. And we talked about even, and we talked before about my background, you know, what, how people feel when they’re forced, when they’re coerced into a position. And I think, uh, you know, if you looked at, you know, just depression and we look at people who feel out of control today, they don’t feel like they have control of their lives. It’s largely because they feel forced into something or that they have to be somewhere. And there is chief affective commitment. They have to have a community, or even if it’s three people and they don’t go to other to people, it doesn’t matter that respect them. And if you, and then if you open up into a larger sort of community where respect, isn’t thought of continuously or other things might be on their mind, they may be some other places on the ladder of inference, probably hundreds of places in the letter of inference.

Louis Carter (27:04):

Now we’re in trouble. So the deeper you go into community and you start getting the help from either social help or other help from an external’s. The, the less that, that risk, that the more that respect flattens and lessons can’t happen. It’s one of the most dangerous things for people that can happen today, happens with vets. It happens with people who are, who have severe depression and people who really need deep help and, um, caregivers, uh, people in organizations, leaders need to know the immense power they have. And, um, in, in, in other people’s lives,

Jim Rembach (27:50):

I think that responsibility is quite massive. Um, but, uh, and I think, you know, the whole high performance thing, um, when you start looking at all of this and being able to create this, and you said it early on is, you know, you, you talked about, you know, the customer and the customer experience and the high performance. So how, tell us how all of this actually does impact the customer.

Louis Carter (28:12):

So one of the first people I’ve talked to in this book was, uh, Amar Bose. He, and he, so the, uh, and, uh, Mar I knew him back when I was at linkage. And, um, so, uh, and one of the things Boz really talks about is this feeling that a customer has with their, I have one on this, a Bose headset with their Bose headset. They love it. They feel an emotional connection to boats. People wonder why is this well, the design, the feeling, the values, it’s everything. It’s the respect for brand it’s respect for excellence, whether it’s the best decibels, musical, uh, audio experience in the world. I’m not sure, but something tells me it probably is. I don’t have my ears. Aren’t that trained? I’ve had swimmer’s ear for about it know for a long time. Cause I splint, but I’m not. So I’m not really certain.

Louis Carter (29:08):

These are the best, but I love them. Some people don’t know why. I’m not sure why, but I love them. And, uh, it seems like the best. So I think a lot of us are like that. We go to certain brands, we use certain brands because there’s an emotional connection to those brands and the same thing, really for why we choose to work for companies. There’s an emotional brand for these big names, for Apple, for Google, for, you know, for Twitter. You know, if we can all stay from home, they’re massive brands. I really want to work for them. I have to work for them or even our institutions in our, in our United States and things. We’re working for the army, the Pentagon, Oh, wow. I have, I have further a clout or something of that nature. These are things that define us in as a, as a, as an individual, and then define us in, in who we are, what we buy, where we, where we work. And that’s why the emotional connectedness comes in. It’s hard to, it’s really, it takes a lifetime to create that emotional brand. And, uh, and, and when you do it, um, it has to be done carefully, has to be done with a lot of investment. Um, and you’ll see the biggest brands have the most investments buying them.

Jim Rembach (30:30):

I mean, that’s a very, very key and important point. Um, but if I’m sitting there and I have a small work group right now, I’m in a contact center, I’m a supervisor and I have a team of, you know, 10, 15 people. And gosh, now they all been thrust into being remote, probably. Um, you know, how do I, how do I actually create all of this emotional connectedness and how do I even break through some of the fear and all of those insecurity issues and trust. I know I have trust now issues with all of humanity, right? I mean, I was talking to somebody earlier today and they’re like, you know, I’ve been stuck in my home in New York city for a long time. And she goes, and I hear all this stuff going outside. And she goes, I’ve never been this afraid in my own home. It’s like, how do you,

Louis Carter (31:15):

Yeah, that’s it. So I’ve heard a lot of, uh, ways that we can start to build trust with people. And one is the, your internal confidence, inner confidence. So one of the resonance of our voice, the way that we come through the cadence, the belief in product, the connection you have to your product and your brand has to come first. All of that has to come from you. And if that doesn’t come through, if people can’t hear it right now, they’re not going to believe you. You have to make things very simple for people right now. There’s so much noise. There’s so much noise out there. We have to knock out the noise and begin to say, this is all you need to do. This is the value. Be very distinct about the value and then help them through it, help people. The hardest part of people, both buying and being served today is helping.

Louis Carter (32:19):

So being a servant leader, that leadership style is more important than ever serving people first, putting people first, helping people first, not and giving them your full attention and presence, that it will win every a hundred percent every day. If you focus on that presence, that resonance that value and folk, it really gives your full self. I guarantee you’ll win every day. Take it. It’s a daily practice though. You have to ask yourself, did I do my best today to do that? And if you did not do it again tomorrow and you’ll do your best tomorrow, every single day, that’s what I’d say to context centers.

Jim Rembach (33:04):

Well, I mean, being someone who is certified in emotional intelligence, I mean your emotional intelligence is all wrapped up in your book and it’s vitally important. And one of the things that’s also important for us in order to be, to connect emotionally that we use on the show are quotes. Is there a quote or two that you like that you can share?

Louis Carter (33:23):

One of the things that I love about emotional intelligence in general is that [inaudible], as you know, was built on two things, really, when you come down to it, the emotional regulation and empathy, if you really broke it down, right. And it would so that if I were to say, what emotional connectedness is, is emotional connectedness is emotional regulation, empathy. Plus that added extra connection between individuals in the organization. So you’re going at, beyond the EEI, you’re going beyond empathy and emotional regulation is so important, by the way, I believe it’s one of the most important competencies possible to create psychological safety in the universe. Daniel, Goldman, and Rubin Baran were completely right in that. And they were so important in doing that. And they connected to neuroscience. And one day you have Elon Musk said, and in a recent, in a recent podcast, Joe Rogan, he said, we’re going to have a chip in our brain, literally in five years, that will create new neural networks for us to re to become more regulated and more connected. And we’re able to meditate to before making really important decisions. So, you know, this rewiring of, of our universe of people to beat, to create more emotionally intelligent, emotionally regulated, empathetic, um, connected decisions is what we all really need.

Jim Rembach (35:12):

So he didn’t give me my quotes though. Lou,

Louis Carter (35:17):

Do you want a coat for my book? Okay. Well from the book, hold on a second, let me get it

Jim Rembach (35:23):

Awesome response. And I don’t know if I want a bore hole in my head to put in the probes that Musk is talking about, however, that crazy, you know, and I don’t want to say never, especially with an Elon Musk.

Louis Carter (35:38):

Um, gosh, I think he’s on the road. He just put that he just put that spaceship into orbit there and he, he’s done incredible things with those Teslas. And now he’s going to put a chip in her head crazy. Who’s going to be the first person. I like the neuro renewable bundling. So my favorite quote, I like this one. So, uh, this is actually okay. So this one was from my killer achievement chapter on page one 82. And we’re talking about failure parties that Intuit had, right? So they had, they hosted failure parties and P and G had, it has its, you know, heroic failure award. And, uh, so it’s, it’s the, it’s the courage to fail and learn from our failures. And so, so, uh, and, uh, WL Gore is actually a neat one. Um, cause they have one, this is action is prized.

Louis Carter (36:36):

Ideas are encouraged and making mistakes, his views, if you’re just part of the creative process. So that’s a cool one. So the quote that I said, because you wanted me to quote myself, right? The quote I said is for resilient organizations, the one rule they all adhere to is embracing failure to leverage the learning well, and talking about the embracing, the failure thing, we have to do that a lot. Um, and in order to be able to move forward, when we talk about getting over the hump on the show, is there a time where you’ve gotten over the hump that you can share time I’ve gotten over the hump? It’s probably been a lot of those times. Uh, let’s think about time I’ve gotten over the hump.

Louis Carter (37:22):

Well, I think if we’re talking work life, especially, I would say it was when I quit my first job and I quit it and I, I remember doing it because of, you know, and, you know, look, I, I have failure too in this because I had failure to communicate and formulate, uh, deep relationships in that company. But, uh, wait. So I want to know they’re all Harvard people, right? So it was not a Harvard guy, so they immediately excluded me. And uh, so they all went out to for drinks one night and, and uh, they locked me in the office to do their work until three in the morning. I had a lot of work to do cause it was everybody’s heart. So I went downstairs and I wanted to, I opened, tried to open up the door was locked and there was the alarm that was in my way. That was one of the humps in my way. So I didn’t know the key. I know the code, I didn’t have a cake. So I had to call up the owner said, Randy, I’m locked in the office and I don’t have the key or code. What do I do? He was a little bit too drunk to answer me. So I had to, I had to stay a while longer and the police had to help to bring me out.

Louis Carter (38:57):

And I’m I vouched at that time that I would never work for somebody like that again. So I was a little reactive, I think in the moment instead of really making friends with them. I said, I went marching into his office and I went over the hump. I tell him how I felt and I left. That was the, and, and I joined another company that was very respectful and he gave me the opportunity to provide products and do them and create products with them. And they made me their VP of research within four years. And I flourished had wonderful people there who were very kind and very, uh, really kind. And I made up all the greatest friends. Y’all from UNH are nice people. It was when I was younger. It was 25 years ago. Now from UNH, some reason I got along with people from people, the people from UNH and not Harvard.

Louis Carter (39:42):

So go figure they’re very down to earth. And I liked that. So that was the major hump in my life career wise. But when I think about, you know, a lot of the things that you have going on in the work from this book and you and I also have talked about some, you know, your, your family dynamic and, um, you know, the focus that you have there and importance of that need and mentioned some of it in your bio, but you’ve have a lot of things going on. But if I was to talk about one goal, you know, what is one goal you can share with us? The one goal that I I’ve always wanted in my life is to, is to get a Lake home and be totally honest. That’s where I’m looking at. And I know many years have said this I’ve been boating since I was a kid and I haven’t had a boat for 25 years and I’ve w and I’m getting older now.

Louis Carter (40:35):

And, uh, so, you know, family grow up and there’ll be, you know, 10, 15, whatever it might be when they get older, probably to get 10, 15 years, I want to have a Lake house. I want to have a boat. So I kinda put together a plan for it. Um, and a boat savings in the boat, um, how I can invest properly. And so I can make that in a 10 year timeframe and I’m very dedicated to it. So that really is my goal. Uh, and I can’t give you anything about, I’m not going to give you anything like about, you know, saving world peace. And, uh, I want to get a boat in a Lake. That’s the honest truth. That’s good man wishes you the very best. Now, before we move on, let’s get a quick word from our sponsor.

Speaker 4 (41:20):

Even better place to work is an easiest solution that gives you a continuous diagnostic on employee engagement, along with integrated activities that will improve employee engagement and leadership skills in everyone. Using this award winning solutions, guaranteed to create motivated, productive, and loyal employees who have great work

Louis Carter (41:34):

Relationships with their colleagues and your customers to learn more about an even better place to work visit [inaudible] dot com forward slash better. Alright, here we go. Fast leader Legion. It’s time.

Speaker 5 (41:46):

Oh God.

Louis Carter (41:47):

Okay. The hump day, hold on is the heart of our show. Lou, where you give us good insights fast. So I’m going to ask you several questions and your job is to give us robust. The Reverend responses are going to help us move onward and upward faster. Lou Carter, are you ready to it?

Speaker 5 (42:01):

Read out, ready to hold down, get ready. Ready?

Louis Carter (42:04):

What is holding you back from being an even better leader today? It’s probably a motion regulation, not regulation. I work on it every day. What is the best leadership advice you have ever received? Uh, take it easy. Be cool. And what is one of your secrets that you believe contributes to your success? Heart, heart, heart, and passion. What do you feel is one of your best tools that helps you lead in business or life relationships and it accountability partners. And what would be one book you could recommend to our Legion? It could be from any genre. Of course, we’re going to put a link to great company.

Louis Carter (42:54):

So everywhere it’s, I can’t say in great company or any of my other books, I can’t say change champions, field guide. I’ll give you, I’ll give you one of my friends. I’ll get you another book. So the book that I think everyone should read, and I think it’s important for every leader to read it because you, everybody, because it, and I’m going to say just why just real quick. And I know it’s, this is the me around it is called the outcomist by Paulo Coelho. I love it because it talks about the fact that we are already home and we don’t need to venture out too much. We can do our work from home and stay focused on our goals here.

Louis Carter (43:35):

Okay. Fast religion. You can find links to that. And other bonus information from today’s show by going to fast leader.net/lou Carter. Okay. Lou, this is my last Humpday. Hold on question. Imagine you were given the opportunity to go back to the age of 25 and you can take the knowledge and skills that you have no back with you, but you can’t take it all and only choose one. So what skill or piece of knowledge would you take back with you and why? By Apple? I would definitely buy Apple. I would buy real estate more real estate. Um, I re I would defend my portfolio would be different 25. I would know about the subprime mortgage crisis. So I would begin to buy out in 2012. It would be, it’d be literally I tell everybody right now. I mean, I don’t, I’m not giving it. I’m not an RIA.

Louis Carter (44:22):

Um, I think right now is the most important time to focus on, you know, if I was telling my 25 year old self, this focus, your real estate, focus on your investments. Um, focus on your tenure plan, because if you let that go, you know, 10 years, it’s, you’re just gonna be focused on your career. Your career is important. And in finances, you gotta, you gotta balance that careers, not enough jobs, not enough. Don’t forget about yourself and the legacy you’re providing to your family and to others, you can do a lot with it too. You can give it away to others to help them do things like philanthropy and has so many. It just has so much possibilities

Jim Rembach (45:04):

I’m with you today. Can you please share with the fast leader Legion, how they can connect with you? Can I save me?

Louis Carter (45:10):

Louiscarter.com. My name is spelled L O U I S. Carter in French version.com. Come to see me there at https://www.bestpracticeinstitute.org/, I own a company called best practices. She checked me out there or https://resultsbasedculture.com/. It’s another one. Throw all three. Thank you for sharing

Jim Rembach (45:27):

Your knowledge and wisdom. The fast leader, Legion honors you, and thanks you for helping us get over the hump.

287: Lolly Daskal – Leading From Within

287: Lolly Daskal – Leading From Within

Lolly Daskal Show Notes Page

Lolly Daskal shares her insights on the many ways a leader can lead from within. Throughout her career, she experienced many humps to overcome, and although leading from within may not be easy, there are certainly many tools and techniques that can help your life more meaningful and memorable.

Lolly Daskal grew up in New York City and she travels around the world on a continuous basis to serve her clients.

From an early age she knew she wanted to learn develop and evolve. And that led to her helping and develop others. In life, we mostly teach what we need to learn.

This has brought her to her journey of who she is. A discovery of self to helping others discover themselves. In life, she studies psychology and philosophy and applies the principles to who she is and what she does.

Lolly is the founder and CEO of Lead From Within, a consulting and coaching company. Lead From Within’s proprietary leadership and coaching programs are engineered to be a catalyst for leaders who want to enhance their performance and also make a meaningful difference in their companies, their lives and the world.

Based on a mix of modern philosophy, science, and nearly 30 years of experience in coaching top executives, Lolly’s perspective on leadership continues to break new ground and produce exceptional results.

She has written several books and is the author of The Leadership Gap: What gets between you and your greatness.

Lolly still lives in New York City and is the proud mother of three grown children.

Tweetable Quotes and Mentions

Listen to @LollyDaskal get over the hump on the @FastLeaderShowClick to Tweet

Control is identifying what we need to do by who we are. – Click to Tweet

The more people oppose to what you say, the more you find you have energy to say it. – Click to Tweet

We have to remember where we came from to where we are today. – Click to Tweet

When we look at our customer as a human being instead of wanting to get something from them, you have a much better relationship. – Click to Tweet

We have within us a polarity of character. Learning to navigate and choose who you’re going to be is where the discipline comes in. – Click to Tweet

Every leader has a choice. In every circumstance that leader can choose to be different. – Click to Tweet

If a leader takes the time to develop themselves, then they have to invest in their people. – Click to Tweet

It’s not only about the leader evolving and growing and becoming who they need to be. The people have to know that their development is just as important. – Click to Tweet

It doesn’t matter what title or position a person is in. Every single person matters. – Click to Tweet

Every single person has something that they want to improve. – Click to Tweet

Every single person is here to be their most valuable. – Click to Tweet

Greatness can be and should be embraced by every single person. – Click to Tweet

You’re valuable, and you do have greatness within you. – Click to Tweet

Hump to Get Over

Lolly Daskal shares that she experienced many humps to overcome, and although leading from within may not be easy, there are certainly many tools and techniques that can help your life more meaningful and memorable.

Advice for others

Be kind to yourself and stop judging yourself.

Holding her back from being an even better leader

Myself.

Best Leadership Advice

Lead from within

Secret to Success

Trying to be authentic every moment in everyday

Best tools in business or life

Self-reflection

Recommended Reading

The Leadership Gap: What Gets Between You and Your Greatness

Man’s Search for Meaning

Contacting Lolly Daskal

Lolly’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/LollyDaskal

Lolly’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lollydaskal

Lolly’s website: https://www.lollydaskal.com/

Resources

 

Show Transcript

Click to access unedited transcript

Unedited Transcript

Jim Rembach (00:00):

Okay, fast leader leading today. I’m excited because we have somebody on the show today who has a great depth and great range of things that we need to know, not just today, but for the future and bringing a whole lot of past and understanding and experience along with it. Lolly Daskal grew up in New York city and she travels around the world on a continuous basis to serve her clients from an early age, she knew she wanted to learn, develop, and evolve, and that led to her helping and developing others in life. We mostly teach what we need to learn. This has brought her to her journey of who she is, a discovery of SEL to helping others discover themselves in life. She studies psychology and philosophy and applies the principles to who she is. And what she does Lolly is the founder and CEO of lead from within a consulting and coaching company lead from within his proprietary leadership and coaching programs are engineered to be a catalyst for leaderships who wants to enhance their performance and also make a meaningful difference in their companies, their lives and the world based on a mix of modern philosophy science and nearly 30 years of experience and coaching top executives, Lolly’s perspective on leadership continues to break new ground and produce exceptional results.

Jim Rembach (01:12):

She has written several books and is the author of the leadership gap. What gets between you and your greatness while he was born and raised in New York city? Like I said, where she lives today and she is the proud mother of three grown children, Lolly Daskal, are you ready to help us get over the hump?

Lolly Daskal (01:27):

Absolutely. So great to be here.

Jim Rembach (01:30):

I’m glad you’re here. And now I’ve given my Legion a little bit about you, but can you share what your current passion is so that we can get to know you even better

Lolly Daskal (01:38):

Currently? I’m actually, I might sound boring because I feel like I’m going to say the same thing. I get the most pleasure and I feel like I’m right on point when I help my clients. And I serve my clients. That to me, I love waking up in the morning because I know I’m going to be making a difference.

Jim Rembach (01:57):

So, but when you start talking about making a difference, I mean, that’s, that’s the very broad, I mean, it’s so when you start looking at specifics and you start looking at impacts and you start looking at efforts and you start looking at constraints and complaints, and I mean, that’s where it gets complex, even talk the mill and to go like, Hey, let me turn my phone off. Cause my clients will call me in emergency. So when you start talking about navigating through all that, especially today, what does that look like?

Lolly Daskal (02:21):

First of all, a couple of things I want to you, to me, you seem to have asked a lot of questions in that one question. So I want to talk about the first thing you said. What does it mean to make a difference? If thinking about myself every single day, I have this ritual that I ask myself, what will you do today? That you were better than yesterday? So I know that I’m always evolving and developing myself. And that’s when I know I’m making a difference because every single client that calls or writes or texts, I always have this mantra and say, leave this person better because they’re talking to you again. I know I’m making a, I know that I’m, I am making a difference, not only my own life, but I’m making a difference in someone else’s. So that’s the first part of your question.

Lolly Daskal (03:07):

How do I know I’m making a difference because I’m very conscious and very deliberate about how I am during the day and who I am. So I know that I am, I can check it off at the end of the night. Secondly is when we are in crisis, when people are feeling panic and anxiety, we tend to get distracted by what’s happening out there instead of what’s going on inside. And you know, my company is called lead from within, and it’s a message that I’ve been saying for over three decades. So there’s a lot of what and who and where and why going on. But if we go back to the hoop, we go back to the core of what we are we can seen not seen, but we can control the outside when we are more controlling of our inside. Meaning when I mean, control is identifying what we need to do by who we are.

Jim Rembach (04:04):

Okay. So there’s one thing that you said in there that I’d like to pull out because I find it very intriguing. When you start talking about, for the past 30 years, I had the opportunity to work for an academic, uh, who was focused in, on the customer experience and worked for her for many years. And she always, uh, sometimes I say, she’d get a little frustrated. She say, I’ve been saying the same thing for 20 years. And I looked at her and said, well, you’ll probably be saying the same for 20 more. So if you start talking about 30 years, right? Um, I’ve been saying the same thing for 30 years. Is there something that you’ve been doing and sang for the same 30?

Lolly Daskal (04:38):

Absolutely. Think of it like a rock star. You know, when you have a hit song and you really love that hit song when it’s meaningful to you, you never get tired of singing it. So at the core of lead from within is so meaningful to me is so purposeful to me that it gives me energy. And the thing is, think about it this way. My message wasn’t very invoked. 10 years ago, 25 years ago, it was almost like crawling up a mountain and saying, you know, you need to think of others. Think about it this way. Leadership in, when I first started out was about authority and it wasn’t about a week. It was about, I do this, you do this. Now the messages let’s do this together. That does not, that has existed for a long time. So even though I’ve been saying from my message for over 30 years, it doesn’t mean it’s been an easy journey. Doesn’t mean that it was people were embracing the message. The more people are opposed to what you say, the more you find your energy to say it. So there’s a think about it this way, the message is old. And the message is something that I say, but the climate within that message is always different. So it’s different the way I show up.

Jim Rembach (05:53):

Well, as you’re talking to, I mean, I deal a lot with the customer experience, customer service, dealing with context centers, and you start talking about how leadership translates, you know, from the inside to the outside. It’s a, permientations, it’s a true, you know, transference. I mean, all of those things that we know are true. So if you start talking to though about those 30 years, how has the whole employee and customer experience come into the leadership communication and mix and context?

Lolly Daskal (06:19):

Absolutely. What a great question. It seemed when I first started out customer service was, was a silo thing. It wasn’t what it is today. It isn’t what it is today. Thank God things have evolved. Thank God people have embraced a different kind of way of customer service. You know, we take for granted that the customer’s always right. It wasn’t always like that. We have to remember where we came from to where we are today. Can we do better? Always. Did we do great from the beginning? Absolutely not. That’s what’s so great about being in your business for, you know, to have longevity because you see how things have evolved. I think today, when we look at our customer as a human being, instead of wanting to get something from them, instead of trying to win them over, but to really embrace them authentically, you have a much better relationship and you actually don’t have to sell as much. You don’t have to proud as much. You find that if I’m showing up authentically, if I’m being there because I want to help you, I want to serve you. Then it’s a much better relationship and you’d get great results.

Jim Rembach (07:29):

Well, even when you say that, though, I start thinking about in today’s climate, where the whole skepticism and lack of trust and all that makes it very difficult. And we also know that there are some perpetrators and some of them in very high offices that are very high profile that may appear, you know, to come across like that. And then when you peel back the little kimono or early on, and you’re like, Oh my gosh, that’s nasty, close it back up. And so it just adds to our whole missing distrust. How do we overcome that?

Lolly Daskal (07:57):

So the great thing is you mentioned earlier, my book, the leadership gap, the leadership gap talks about that we have within us, a polarity of character, every single person has it. It’s based on psychology. It’s actually based on young. We have a part of us that is great and great. Let’s put it in quotes because great means wonderful, authentic, true character, meaning purposeful. And then we all have a side when we are stressed. When we have anxiety, when we’re in crisis, we have a side that comes out that young, used to call a shadow. And I call the gap where we are not at our best, where we say things. We don’t want to say you called it. You know, behind the kimono, there are things that are not that great about each one of us. We’re not perfect human beings. If we go around saying that we are these complete human beings without any flaws, we are a disservice to humanity because we have within us as polarity.

Lolly Daskal (08:59):

We’re good. We’re great. We’re bad. We’re not so great. But it’s learning to navigate and choose who you’re going to be is where the discipline comes in. So with the kimono, yes, it exists. But that leader has a choice. Now think about it this way. In every circumstance that leader can choose to be different. If they don’t for many years, trust me, I know this, I’ve seen this. Something will happen that we’ll have that leader come undone. And then all of a sudden they’re looking at their lives. They’re reflecting on their mistakes. And you know, there is this journey that everybody goes on, maybe the first 30 years of their lives, everything is working out, but it happens to all of us. There is what we call a breakdown in humanity within ourselves, where we start to question ourselves, Oh, I can’t believe that’s what I’m doing. Maybe I need to do something else. You see people later on in life going into charities and philanthropies, but there’s a reason because there’s this ease within themselves. Maybe they got an illness, but it’s really cold. A dis ease, meaning within yourself as a human being.

Jim Rembach (10:10):

Well, so I guess we call that the midlife crisis and some of us have multiples of those. Right.

Lolly Daskal (10:16):

You know, psychology says it’s every seven years we go through that every seven years. So it’s yeah,

Jim Rembach (10:22):

It’s a, it’s definitely, it’s definitely a cycle. Um, so I guess the thing is for me, as you’re talking and I’m thinking about the customer connection and all that, a lot of times they talk about the disconnection between the top and head of an organization in the feet of the organization. And so, you know, I may think I’m delivering this experience up here. And this is the one that we’re actually saying that we’re delivering. And, but when you actually, when all that gets filtered down, you know, and it gets to the frontline, very different things are occurring. And I think that’s a common problem. So think about it from an overall leadership investment perspective. We spend all this money up here for all these executives, but then when we get down to the frontline, it’s none of that is applied. How can we prevent that?

Lolly Daskal (11:02):

I hear this all the time. How do you know there’s so much happening on top? By the time it gets filtered down, either the messages, laws, it’s not felt the way it needs to be. I think, you know, people talk about that. It could be trust, right? But you know what really, I find that the core of that is it’s called communication. I find that if people are talking at people, if you at the top, right, if they have this view, you’re at the top of the mountain and talking at people, then the message, by the time it reaches the bottom, it’s like, what did you say? But if you bring the bottom and the middle to the top, and it’s more of a group, it’s more of we’re in this together. This is what we need to say. This is how we should think about it.

Lolly Daskal (11:50):

It’s not that I’m telling you what to do. My communication, do this, say this, but communication is you’re down there. Right, right. You know, what’s going on in the foxhole. So what is really happening? Tell us to the top. And then we can together create the message because you’re there. You know, even though I have an idea that I think it needs to happen. So when I work in an organization, I usually start with the CEO, right. That’s where the board of directors brings me in. That’s where an HR director brings me in. And I talked to them about their communication is just not filtering down. Well, guess what I do then over time, I start the bottom of the organization. I work from the top of the organization and I work on bringing them together. That’s part of my work. So it becomes a week, not a me. And it becomes a message that’s embraced by them.

Jim Rembach (12:42):

Okay. So for me, I start thinking as someone who does marketing and lead generation and all of those types of things, I started thinking of an overall campaign and process. And of course, something like this as an ongoing campaign that should never end. Right. Um, so I would dare to say that, you know, you’re going and engineering an entire experience for the executive.

Lolly Daskal (13:04):

I am actually, um, not only for the executive, but for the organization as well. This is what I really believe. I believe that if a leader takes the time to develop themselves, then they have to invest in their people. It’s not only that a leader is evolving and growing and becoming who they need to be. Your company. Your people have to know that they’re just as important their development. We have these things that we call master classes that I create these classes within an organization that people can hand choose to take a masterclass of themselves. What do I need to help myself? Just like the CEO, the CEO is not up here and I’m down here. No, we’re in this together. And that’s part of leading from within that every single person matters. It doesn’t matter what position you’re in or title.

Jim Rembach (13:52):

Well, okay. So, but as you’re saying that you often find, um, when you, especially when you start talking about the size of the organization, you have more people who just don’t want to engage in that particular process. And so people will come from different perspectives and lenses about addressing those particular people. But what are you teaching executives for people who don’t want to be part of the group?

Lolly Daskal (14:14):

Oh, trust me. Um, if we’re in video, you know, I’m this blonde woman, I’m very petite. I walk into a room with engineers, every single one of them snares at me the first hour. It’s like, who is this woman? By the time I’m done. It’s like, Oh wow. This is the best day of my life. I go, what about your marriage? No, no. This is the best day of my life. I have testimonials that are so funny. And I go, I know, and I say this and I’m there I go. I know you’re not expecting much from me, but I’m here to surprise you. And in here, this is not about me. It’s about you. And so every CEO will say, you’ll never get to that hardcore group that think this is LA LA. You know, it’s like, we hope this focus. We don’t need this, but this is, I found two things to be true.

Lolly Daskal (15:02):

When you have an organization where some people are very excited, their energy is contagious. They want to know what that person is getting and why they’re so happy and why their workload seems to be more streamlined. And you know, it just seems like everything is more effective than before then you have those that come kicking and screaming. I don’t want to do this. This is not for me. I don’t want to be in therapy. And I go, this isn’t therapy. This is, I always say, do you want to be happier? Do you want to work less? Do you want to be more effective? If the answers are, yes, come on, join me for an hour. You don’t like it. You never have to come back. And in all these decades, listen, if I can win over some engineers, I could win over most of an organization. Sorry, engineers. You know, I love you, but it is true.

Jim Rembach (15:49):

Well, I can understand. I mean, I mean, they’re gonna have certain characteristics and personality types that are amongst that group and, you know, um, and then, so I get what you’re talking about. Um, but when you start doing this, you’re saying that, I mean, I’m getting excited. I’m like, Oh, well, what, what could transform and make that happen? Because here’s the thing. Especially when you start, let’s take all the way down to the frontline. Cause I have a virtual leadership Academy called call center coach, where we focused on the leadership skills for frontline supervisors. And you do, when you start dealing with frontline, you know, contact center agents, you know, you do have some people that are not going to buy, buy in. They’re not going to be part of it. They’re like, I didn’t sign up for this. Even though we may have through our hiring process, tried to scream for all of that. Um, you know, they got through, I mean, what do you advocate? Or you say, Hey, you know what, it’s a coach up or coach out. I mean, what do you actually teach?

Lolly Daskal (16:41):

No, I never say that. So I don’t do that. I don’t want people to feel that they are threatened or anything like this. Let me tell you a little secret about what I do. I don’t think I’ve ever talked about this. The thing about it is, think about an organization. Most individuals that are there will tell you if they tell you the truth is that they’re not heard all the time. They’re not listened to all the time. Their words don’t have the kind of importance that they want to have. They feel they can do more, but they’re not being seen. Every single person has something that they want to improve, that they want to do better. And my job, this is, this is a secret. My job is before I make anybody show up, which I never make anybody show up. But before I invite them, I find out what is the core driver of that individual that is saying no. And then I say, if, if there’s one thing that you want and I can get that for you, what would it be? And they tell me, and I go come and I will show you how you get it. Everybody shows up because as human beings we have needs and wants. And most of the time they’re not being met specially in an organization. But if you tell that person, I can give you what you’ve always wanted, they show up, they’re curious. And then it’s my job to keep them there.

Jim Rembach (18:04):

Well, as you say that, I mean, for me, I start quickly reflecting on even things that have happened in the past week where maybe I could have taken that approach and, and failed to do it. So thank you for sharing that.

Lolly Daskal (18:13):

So what was the core of that? The core was not about me. It’s about them, right? That’s what I learned at a very early age that if I am going to truly lead from within, then I have to write con take myself out of the equation and really get connected to the other human being about what their need is, what their want is. Once you tap into that, there’s no, no, it’s always a yes.

Jim Rembach (18:41):

Well, you even mentioned a lot about the whole self discovery and, you know, finding of self and connecting of self. And there are, um, you know, individuals that will just say, well, I don’t know what I want. I don’t know what I need. I don’t know. And so how do you connect with that?

Lolly Daskal (18:57):

What does that is so true? And that I would say is 70% of our workforce. They’ll say, I don’t know. You’re asking me these questions. So I have a way of asking the same question in a thousand different ways that doesn’t make people feel uncomfortable. So when someone says, I don’t know what I like, or I don’t know what I want. So I’ll say, give me an example of what you do in a day. And they’ll say, this is what I do. This is my role. This is my position. If you could make that job be more effective, what would one thing that you would like to change? Trust me, there’s a list. They come with like, Oh, what this, I want this, I go, okay. Let’s so you do have wants, you do have needs sometimes. It’s the way, it’s the art of the question, right? So instead of being a bulldozer, what are your needs? What are your wants? No, invest in the person that you’re talking to find out more about them. And then I, this is in my book, the archetype is the navigator navigate through the conversation so you can help serve them.

Jim Rembach (20:00):

Well, I know all of this can be challenging for folks to be able to do the discovery, to be able to apply the changes and, and all of those things. But you know, your, you had mentioned something about it being possibly easy and you having hacks and shortcuts, but what do you mean by that?

Lolly Daskal (20:18):

Okay. What a great question. So nothing in life is easy because the thing is, whatever is really worthwhile. There is there is, has to be a method of what you do, right? So this is the easy part. If I show up at every conversation saying whoever I’m talking to is the most important person in that moment in my life. It makes the conversation with that person easy. Right? That’s the easy part. Then I have to, the second thing is I have to remain curious. It’s not about me. I’m not going to tell you what I ate for lunch. I’m not going to tell you where it was last night. But if I ask open ended questions about you as a human being, who are you, what do you want, what do you want to achieve? How do you want to leave your Mark? Nobody spends the time talking to individuals on that level. And I find the reason why the engineers leave saying that was great is because they felt seen, they felt recognized and appreciated, and that’s where it makes lead from within and this process. So memorable and so meaningful. So is it easy, maybe? Maybe not, but is it memorable and does it leave a Mark? Absolutely. Every time without fail?

Jim Rembach (21:36):

Well, without a doubt, it’s inspirational. And one of the things that we do on the show is we look for quotes to help us hold on, to grab, or maybe ignite some inspiration. Is there a quote or two that you liked that you can share?

Lolly Daskal (21:47):

Um, on there’s so many quotes. Um, but one of the things that I like to say, there are many things I say, because in organizations, they call them lolly isms that I even wrote a book on it, a 500. I called it a hard spoken, you know, things spoken from the heart, but there are two things that I feel that are very important to say, every single person is here to be their most valuable. I really believe that each one of us is here for a reason. What that reason is, is up to you to discover. The second thing is, is that people believe that success and greatness is really for others, right? It’s for them, it’s not for me. And so the thing that I want to say is that greatness can be and should be embraced by every single one. And it’s not only for the privileged it’s for you. It’s for me, it’s for every single person. So those things are very important in my life. You’re valuable. And you do have greatness within you.

Jim Rembach (22:44):

Well, I would dare to say, when you start talking about the evolutionary process and all those books and then volumes and things and all the discovery piece and much like I even share with you before I just reflected on something that, you know, I know I did that I should have done differently and now I can’t take it back. And hopefully I’ll use that as a learning experience and not repeat it. But, you know, we have humps that we’ve gotten over that have caused us to have, you know, learning opportunities that hope hopefully we use as something to better ourselves in than others. Is there a time where you’ve gotten over the hump that you can share?

Lolly Daskal (23:12):

I get over homes every single day. Um, I think about, um, things where I could have shown up better. I think about things that I want the things to go a certain way and it didn’t, and I might get angry about it. And I find that when we get stressed about things, when we get triggered about things, we’re not at our best, there’s so many homes. I mean, at the end of the day, I was go, you could have done better. You could have been, you could have tried harder. You could have been more patient. And so I’m a, I’m an, that does self reflection on an hourly basis. I don’t, I told the client the other day, I said, you live in the past and you live in the future as a leader, but you never live in the present. And what would it be like to be present in the moment?

Lolly Daskal (23:59):

And he said, I don’t know what that is. So I gave him a little, I said, every hour set your Apple watch for 12 o’clock or 1215, or whatever, 1230, whatever it is set every hour, do the same time and stop whatever you’re doing. I don’t care if you’re in a conference, you’re talking to the board members. I don’t care, stop for a minute and say, say what you’re grateful for in that moment. And he did this for 24 hours. Uh, you know, not while he slept, he didn’t do it. And he texted me and he said, I love this because it brings me back to the moment. That’s what I’m talking about lead from within is it’s not easy, but there are tools and techniques that we can do that make our life more memorable and meaningful.

Jim Rembach (24:44):

Well, when you start talking about this and even going in context of the past 30 years of work and start thinking about your next 30 years of work and, uh, Oh yeah, you can never end. You’re not allowed. I start thinking of some, you know, goals that you may have. Is there one that you can share with us?

Lolly Daskal (25:02):

Absolutely. I’ve been in my business for a long time. And especially with the climate of what we have now, the way business was run. I mean, I’m, I’m coaching that there’s a new normal. And so for me, I want to think about it this way. It’s when I always wanted to write a book and then I wrote a book. And the reason why I wanted to write a book is that I felt that if you couldn’t meet me, you couldn’t talk to me. You would get to know me through my work. You would get to learn about what I do with others. And so the next evolution of lolly Daskal is how do I reach others without having to show up, you know, what an organization, without having to run my masterclass in person, that’s something I’m thinking about.

Jim Rembach (25:46):

And the fast leader, Legion wishes you the very best. Now, before we move on, let’s get a quick word from our sponsor. And even better place to work is an easy to use solution that gives you a continuous diagnostic on employee engagement. Along with integrated activities. They want to improve employee engagement and leadership skills in everyone. Using this award winning solutions, guaranteed to create motivated, productive, and loyal employees who have great work relationships with our colleagues and your customers to learn more about an even better place to work visit [inaudible] dot com forward slash better. Alright, here we go. Fastly Allegion. It’s time for the home. Oh, now. Okay. Lolly, the healthy hotel is the part of our show where you give us good insights fast. So I’m going to ask you several questions and your job is to give us robust yet revenue responses that are going to help us move onward and upward, faster lolly Daskal. Are you ready to hoedown? Absolutely. So what is holding you back from being an even better leader today? What is the best leadership advice you’ve ever received lead from within? What is one of your secrets that you believe contributes to your success?

Lolly Daskal (26:50):

Trying to be authentic every moment in every day,

Jim Rembach (26:53):

What do you feel is one of your best tools that helps you lead in business or life, self reflection and what would be one book? Although you have thousands of behind you, and of course you can recommend a few others, um, that you would recommend to our Legion. It can be from any genre. Of course, we’re gonna put a link to leadership gap. What gets between you and your greatness on your show notes page as well?

Lolly Daskal (27:16):

A book that I’ve read for the past 27 years on my birthday, I read the same book every year is the man’s search for meaning by Viktor Frankl, because it’s a book that every time you read it, depending where you are in life, you’ll have a different meaning. And because each one of us, we talked about people go through struggles. So whatever you’re struggling with, Viktor Frankl teaches us that if you find meaning in it, you’re able to survive it.

Jim Rembach (27:40):

Okay. Fast, literally. And you can find links to that and other bonus different vacation from today’s show by going to fast leader.net/lolly Daskal okay. Lollies is my last hump. They hold on question. Imagine you’ve been given the opportunity to take the knowledge and skills that you have now back with you, um, to the age of 25. But you know, you can’t take it all. You can only take one. So what skill or knowledge would you take back with you and why

Lolly Daskal (28:04):

Be kind to yourself and stop judging yourself? We’re so quick to judge ourselves when we aren’t on point that sometimes it can cost us from moving forward and making progress.

Jim Rembach (28:18):

Lolly, I had fun with you today. Can you please share with the fast leader Legion, how they can connect with you?

Lolly Daskal (28:22):

Absolutely. You can find me on my website. I write for inc Harvard business view psychology today, but find me on Twitter and LinkedIn under lolly Daskal I don’t think there’s another lolly. So it’s a lolly. Daskal

Jim Rembach (28:34):

Molly Vasco. Thank you for sharing your knowledge and wisdom. The fast leader, Legion honors you, and thanks you for helping us get over the hump.